Replace the Unathi consular's Chinese broadsword

[DronzTheWolf]

The Unathi consular of the Izweski Hegemony spawns with a sword. A Chinese Dao, to be specific. I'd like to change this and, instead, give them an Unathi-made energy saber. 
I call it the Noble Saber, and it's description would read something along the lines of 'An Unathi-made energy weapon favored by noblemen and influential individuals for it's more painful, though less lethal attacks.' It would, preferably, do more hallos than damage so it'd be better for subduing rather than killing. 

I feel as though the weapon would suit them better than a human sword, however it's rather large handle would mean it'd be stored on the belt slot as opposed to in pockets. Mostly for balance purposes.

I've attached a .dmi of the weapon below.

Consular Sword Icon.dmi Consular Sword.dmi

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

Love it!

[Carver]

My only complaint is an energy blade is inherently less showy than the typical ceremonial sword might be, and it starts to fall into the consideration that by allowing such, normal energy swords may be seen as far less immediately illegal to own. I have mixed feelings but I suppose when things are abused they can be reported.

[Zundy]

Why not make it an "Ion sword" and by that I mean a ceremonial looking plasteel sword that, when activated, is sheathed in an energy field akin to an energy blade? Best of both words aesthetically.

[DronzTheWolf]

8 hours ago, Carver said:

My only complaint is an energy blade is inherently less showy than the typical ceremonial sword might be, and it starts to fall into the consideration that by allowing such, normal energy swords may be seen as far less immediately illegal to own. I have mixed feelings but I suppose when things are abused they can be reported.

The energy glaives produced by Science are already seen as far less illegal than smuggled-in traitor swords. Energy swords/glaives/shields, etc.. 

[Carver]

1 hour ago, DronzTheWolf said:

The energy glaives produced by Science are already seen as far less illegal than smuggled-in traitor swords. Energy swords/glaives/shields, etc.. 

I'd say it's an element of poor RP that people often ignore the production and distribution of legitimate contraband, or rather that they normalize it in their minds for every round after having experienced 1-2 tense rounds where it was actually needed for them. Regardless, I'd merely prefer that it's not an energy blade and instead something like Zundy suggested (or just a plain wallhanger-tier sword). Anything that makes it at least visibly more ceremonial and less 'military-grade concealable weapon that for some reason is allowed on the station for a consular'.

[Alberyk]

I am against giving the crew an energy weapon like that. It would be better if they just had a regular sword.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

If its an energy sword you can keep it in your pocket and not open carry. Consulars probably shouldnt open carry.

What is the difference between energy and metal? The mouthfeel? @Alberyk

[Alberyk]

They can do much more than a regular, like blocking ranged attacks and dismantling wall.

[Carver]

3 hours ago, Marlon Phoenix said:

If its an energy sword you can keep it in your pocket and not open carry. Consulars probably shouldnt open carry.

A ceremonial weapon isn't something you'd hide, and a concealable weapon of the sort just straight up isn't allowed on the station (As you otherwise open the floodgate of everyone and their mother thinking it's okay to keep concealed weapons because some random Consular/diplomatic figure is allowed to for some arbitrary reason). The inherent difference between keeping an energy blade and, say, an energy gun or the like for self-defense is that the former is inherently a lethal weapon. It's a blade by design.

[Brutishcrab51]

I believe the original post states that due to the larger hilt of the sword, it would be stored on the belt-slot instead of in pockets.Just made it a medium-size or small-size item instead of a tiny one. Ez.

[Carver]

43 minutes ago, Brutishcrab51 said:

I believe the original post states that due to the larger hilt of the sword, it would be stored on the belt-slot instead of in pockets.Just made it a medium-size or small-size item instead of a tiny one. Ez.

The blade is still concealed is my only concern. If it's a normal, unsharpened sword that happens to have a switch to electrify it that'd be able to function just fine mechanically in regard to giving a self-defense weapon that isn't inherently lethal and doesn't normalize energy sword-type weaponry.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

3 hours ago, Carver said:

A ceremonial weapon isn't something you'd hide, and a concealable weapon of the sort just straight up isn't allowed on the station (As you otherwise open the floodgate of everyone and their mother thinking it's okay to keep concealed weapons because some random Consular/diplomatic figure is allowed to for some arbitrary reason). The inherent difference between keeping an energy blade and, say, an energy gun or the like for self-defense is that the former is inherently a lethal weapon. It's a blade by design.

Consulars have 9mm pistols that they conceal in their pockets.

The weapons are not ceremonial. The sword is for self defense.

Edited August 23, 2019 by Marlon Phoenix

[Carver]

1 hour ago, Marlon Phoenix said:

Consulars have 9mm pistols that they conceal in their pockets.

The weapons are not ceremonial. The sword is for self defense.

And yet an energy sword is an assassin's weapon, not a weapon designed for self-defense. Having a concealed pistol is a whole other deal than a weapon that can take an arm off in one swing through full armour. By all means, carry a proper sword that can be seen readily and quite visibly on the hip in a sheathe (no, a lightsaber hilt does not count as visible), but not the type of sword an antagonist would sneak aboard and slit the Captain's throat with.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

Thats an arbitrary distinction

[Brutishcrab51]

14 hours ago, Carver said:

And yet an energy sword is an assassin's weapon, not a weapon designed for self-defense. Having a concealed pistol is a whole other deal than a weapon that can take an arm off in one swing through full armour. By all means, carry a proper sword that can be seen readily and quite visibly on the hip in a sheathe (no, a lightsaber hilt does not count as visible), but not the type of sword an antagonist would sneak aboard and slit the Captain's throat with.

Lightsabers are an assassin's weapon. Not really.

 

You can see a hilt on someone's belt, sprite-wise and examine-wise. Having a melee weapon as opposed to a ranged weapon is debilitating enough, it's a sword on an Unathi Consul. Not a laser dagger on an assassin.

 

You make little sense and this feels like a red herring, not to discredit your post.

[DronzTheWolf]

It isn't meant to be a very deadly weapon, dealing damage and hallos equal to a harmbaton, but I hear your complaints. I'll see how it looks with a steel blade, but it'd have to be deadlier. Doing less hallos damage and more physical/sharp damage on par to the other swords in-code. 

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

Lightsabers are used by hippy monks and knights in starwars....

And most importantly in auroea the nobility of the hegemony. Its used by who we say it is.

[Carver]

56 minutes ago, Marlon Phoenix said:

Lightsabers are used by hippy monks and knights in starwars....

And most importantly in auroea the nobility of the hegemony. Its used by who we say it is.

It's also used by syndicate sleeper agents and is considered 'outright contraband' as per this page (https://wiki.aurorastation.org/index.php?title=Uplink). I don't see Arabic dictators bringing their golden AKs during trips to foreign countries, nor would their ambassadors be carrying such.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

It's contraband because it's a sword.... A 9mm pistol is also contraband if you aren't cleared to carry it....The consulars carry a pistol that you can attach a silencer to that they carry in their pocket... Golden AK's aren't part of the consular equipment of arabic majority countries.... I don't understand....

Edited August 24, 2019 by Marlon Phoenix

[Kaed]

17 hours ago, Carver said:

It's also used by syndicate sleeper agents and is considered 'outright contraband' as per this page (https://wiki.aurorastation.org/index.php?title=Uplink). I don't see Arabic dictators bringing their golden AKs during trips to foreign countries, nor would their ambassadors be carrying such.

We're moving towards making antag identification not be so easily metagamed, with the introduction of Survivor roles among other things.

That page will just have to be updated, and people have to use their brains instead of going Unga Bunga energy blade equal antag.

[Carver]

6 hours ago, Kaed said:

We're moving towards making antag identification not be so easily metagamed, with the introduction of Survivor roles among other things.

That page will just have to be updated, and people have to use their brains instead of going Unga Bunga energy blade equal antag.

Energy blades being the military-grade equivalent of a switchblade does not help their case. Especially when, unlike a switch blade, there's no utility usage and they are intended for outright murdering people. A 9mm can carry any sort of rounds (rubber/flash/live), and is quite notably loud (unless one illegally adds a silencer). It can't be used to cut through walls, and it won't pose a significant threat to equipped/armoured Security personnel (you know, the people who'd actually be protecting a consular), unlike an energy blade. My comparison of 'bringing your golden AK to a foreign nation on a diplomatic mission' stands.

[Kaed]

50 minutes ago, Carver said:

Energy blades being the military-grade equivalent of a switchblade does not help their case. Especially when, unlike a switch blade, there's no utility usage and they are intended for outright murdering people. A 9mm can carry any sort of rounds (rubber/flash/live), and is quite notably loud (unless one illegally adds a silencer). It can't be used to cut through walls, and it won't pose a significant threat to equipped/armoured Security personnel (you know, the people who'd actually be protecting a consular), unlike an energy blade. My comparison of 'bringing your golden AK to a foreign nation on a diplomatic mission' stands.

As far as I understand, the consular's position is intended to be outside normal crew and security hierarchies.  They are an ambassador and their office is an embassy.  While the two groups (security and the consular) can and do certainly interact with each other, they are not held to the same standards of contraband and regulations as the crew. Their weapon is issued for self defense and is explicitly intended to be lethal.  The 9mm pistol, while theoretically capable of being loaded with nonlethal ammunition, is for all intents and purposes not actually going to be loaded with them unless someone is engaging in some self-nerfing for roleplay purposes. They certainly will not be going around shooting people with a gun unless antaggery is involved, and by that time, the fact that they start with a gun is a fairly minor detail compared to other issues of their permitted conduct.

The same arguement of 'potential uses does not equal actual uses in most rounds' can be applies to an energy blade weapon.  You are making much more ado over its ability to kill and cut down walls than really matters in actual gameplay.  For the most part, a typical unathi consular is going to do little more than wear it and perhaps brandish it for the purposes of a show of power or skill during certain circumstances.  Welders can also cut through walls, and are freely available to every crew member on the station, and many people on station can even procure the welding helmets necessary to avoid the only downside of welding through walls.  If you think a competent security team will be significantly threatened by a single unathi with an energy blade and no real armor to back it up (because again, we're talking about base gear, not stuff you can acquire illegally), I'm not sure you've been paying attention to how powerful halloss weapons are for the last year or more.

Edited August 25, 2019 by Kaed

[Carver]

On 24/08/2019 at 16:30, Kaed said:

As far as I understand, the consular's position is intended to be outside normal crew and security hierarchies.  They are an ambassador and their office is an embassy.  While the two groups (security and the consular) can and do certainly interact with each other, they are not held to the same standards of contraband and regulations as the crew. Their weapon is issued for self defense and is explicitly intended to be lethal.  The 9mm pistol, while theoretically capable of being loaded with nonlethal ammunition, is for all intents and purposes not actually going to be loaded with them unless someone is engaging in some self-nerfing for roleplay purposes. They certainly will not be going around shooting people with a gun unless antaggery is involved, and by that time, the fact that they start with a gun is a fairly minor detail compared to other issues of their permitted conduct.

The same arguement of 'potential uses does not equal actual uses in most rounds' can be applies to an energy blade weapon.  You are making much more ado over its ability to kill and cut down walls than really matters in actual gameplay.  For the most part, a typical unathi consular is going to do little more than wear it and perhaps brandish it for the purposes of a show of power or skill during certain circumstances.  Welders can also cut through walls, and are freely available to every crew member on the station, and many people on station can even procure the welding helmets necessary to avoid the only downside of welding through walls.  If you think a competent security team will be significantly threatened by a single unathi with an energy blade and no real armor to back it up (because again, we're talking about base gear, not stuff you can acquire illegally), I'm not sure you've been paying attention to how powerful halloss weapons are for the last year or more.

By being on the station itself, you submit to the regulations and directives of NanoTrasen. Being an ambassador does not exclude one from the laws, customs and so forth of wherever their embassy is located. If you consider halloss to be 'powerful' then perhaps you ought to remember just how heavily nerfed it is, if your argument is 'no real armour' then I know you're full of shit from how trivial it is for an antagonist to get armour via theft or simply making it. The 'Golden AK' argument stands, as an energy sword is not something that belongs on station, otherwise we may as well let Tajaran consulars bring their personal Icelance rifles.

[Kaed]

8 hours ago, Carver said:

By being on the station itself, you submit to the regulations and directives of NanoTrasen. Being an ambassador does not exclude one from the laws, customs and so forth of wherever their embassy is located. If you consider halloss to be 'powerful' then perhaps you ought to remember just how heavily nerfed it is, if your argument is 'no real armour' then I know you're full of shit from how trivial it is for an antagonist to get armour via theft or simply making it. The 'Golden AK' argument stands, as an energy sword is not something that belongs on station, otherwise we may as well let Tajaran consulars bring their personal Icelance rifles.

Icelance rifles would be pretty sweet on the tajaran ambassador, tbh.  Culturally relevant, too!  But that's not really the subject.

I don't think your argument really holds much water except to you.  What I'm hearing is basically "if we allow this fun, interesting thing, then we might as well do this other fun, interesting thing!" presented as if it is a dangerous slippery slope instead of a logical progression of lore inclusion that I think we should be encouraging.

And in any case. Laser swords and icelance rifles are not illegal ordinance if there is a permit involved, just like every other fucking weapon that can be obtained by crew by means such as the merchant.  Just give them a permit with certain restrictions on their use of the weapon and bam, justification created.

Edited August 28, 2019 by Kaed