Scuttling-Remap

[ReadThisNamePlz]

Alright, so. I've been thinking. 

The scuttling device is way too accessible, and I don't like that we lack a vault. 

I want to move the scuttling device from deck three, to deck one- and put it under the AI chamber. There is a perfect area for it, and it's way more secure. It'd make a lot more sense in my opinion to have it there. The command bunker has way more secrecy/security than the ships SCUTTLING device. Like. C'mon. 

Secondly, I want to put a vault in the spot that the current scuttle device is. Why?
1. Antags need more targets than just the Armory, scuttling device or Captains office. 
2. I want to change up the corporate safe container, give it more.. updated items. 
3. The thermal drill safe is a pointless buy. I could remove it from the uplinks, but where's the fun in that?
4. A vault would also allow for high-value items to be securely stored in a place that only Command could access. I don't want Security to store a automatic shotgun that's found on an away site, in the armory and then use it against some poor vampire or traitor. 

I do not want to make this a PR without feedback. 

I'd place the nuke here. I'd have to change it up a bit, but I think it honestly makes the most sense. 

[EJJ]

I like it! I've missed the vault from Aurora because it gave lots of varied RP. You'd have antags breaking in to steal it, Ion or unlawed AI/Stationbound stealing the money or using it to hide things and a various other things. I think it'd be really interesting to have it added.
I feel like the transition to Horizon has sort of culled a few of the concepts that were easier on the Aurora so I'd love to see the Vault come back.

Plus having a place physical cash is stored makes some command interactions more interesting.

I had meant to put this in my original post but it was like 11 at the time.
Anyway, someone a bit ago mentioned that putting the scuttling room more in line with the crew armory/command bunker could be cool, but obviously more hidden than it is now. Maybe accessible via maint instead of just walking in?

Edited June 25, 2022 by EJJ
added a new idea

[wowzewow]

I'm quite surprised we haven't had a vault all this time. Not a bad idea, IMHO.

[KingOfThePing]

As already discussed, I think the idea is good. The scuttling device being kind of just in the Central Hallway is a bit silly (meaning: very silly). I support this idea.

[Kintsugi]

Going to play devil's advocate here:
The scuttling device doesn't need secrecy. It is common knowledge the ship has one, and it is totally inert and safe unless the SCC provides a code to detonate it. If anything, it is good that it is outside the bridge. In a situation where you actually need to scuttle the ship, you don't want it to be isolated (and therefore vulnerable) and hard to get to. You want it to be in a location that is easily accessible and easily-defended.

As for the vault, I guess there's no harm in having one... Except that I've always found that "rob the vault" gimmicks are very, very boring. The contents of the vault are meaningless and vault gimmicks just tend to not be engaging.

[Roostercat]

Going to second Danse's opinion on Vault gimmicks. They tend to always go one way and usually aren't fun for anyone but security and the antagonists. I don't think we'd benefit from re-adding it, even if it does make more sense for the Horizon to have one as opposed to the Aurora.

[ReadThisNamePlz]

4 hours ago, DanseMacabre said:

Going to play devil's advocate here:
The scuttling device doesn't need secrecy. It is common knowledge the ship has one, and it is totally inert and safe unless the SCC provides a code to detonate it. If anything, it is good that it is outside the bridge. In a situation where you actually need to scuttle the ship, you don't want it to be isolated (and therefore vulnerable) and hard to get to. You want it to be in a location that is easily accessible and easily-defended.

As for the vault, I guess there's no harm in having one... Except that I've always found that "rob the vault" gimmicks are very, very boring. The contents of the vault are meaningless and vault gimmicks just tend to not be engaging.

I appreciate the position you've taken, but I have to argue that the reason of 'it can't be detonated without the scc' is fundamentally flawed. 

A nuclear device, regardless of the activation method, should not be sitting in a public hallway behind a single door. The Captains office has more security than the nuclear bomb. Shoot, even xenobiology does. The command bunker has more isolation than the device that can destroy the ship? I just don't find it very believable. 

The vaults contents are going to be reworked- I'm working on the PR for the safe contents, and the items that spawn on the tables inside. It's going to be relatively small as well, and while the gimmicks may be a bit boring in some cases- it allows for a different goal that isn't just - "I'm gonna steal the nuke!" (insert Nicholas Cage) - or, "We're going to silently rob the armory then take the ship!". 

[ReadThisNamePlz]

4 hours ago, Roostercat said:

Going to second Danse's opinion on Vault gimmicks. They tend to always go one way and usually aren't fun for anyone but security and the antagonists. I don't think we'd benefit from re-adding it, even if it does make more sense for the Horizon to have one as opposed to the Aurora.

I feel like it'd provide better variation from what we see currently. Which seems to be just - Steal the nuke or rob the armory after getting the Captains office. There isn't any other high value area to really hit. Will this provide another issue for Security? Sure it will. That's kind of the point- the vault is, and always has been antag bait. But this will also give us another place to store things that just make sense. The Aurora having a vault? Didn't make much sense. But a ship that is literally going to be going into deep, uncharted space? Makes a lot of sense to me, in all honesty. 

[Roostercat]

2 hours ago, ReadThisNamePlz said:

I feel like it'd provide better variation from what we see currently. Which seems to be just - Steal the nuke or rob the armory after getting the Captains office. There isn't any other high value area to really hit. Will this provide another issue for Security? Sure it will. That's kind of the point- the vault is, and always has been antag bait. But this will also give us another place to store things that just make sense. The Aurora having a vault? Didn't make much sense. But a ship that is literally going to be going into deep, uncharted space? Makes a lot of sense to me, in all honesty. 

This just adds "Rob the vault" to the list of three total common gimmicks, it doesn't really fix the issue. Robbing the vault, again, doesn't really involve anyone BUT security as well. Encouraging gimmicks that basically exist to end in TDM like this isn't very conductive to roleplay. While it might make sense for the ship to have one, I think the former is a good enough reason not to.

[ReadThisNamePlz]

45 minutes ago, Roostercat said:

This just adds "Rob the vault" to the list of three total common gimmicks, it doesn't really fix the issue. Robbing the vault, again, doesn't really involve anyone BUT security as well. Encouraging gimmicks that basically exist to end in TDM like this isn't very conductive to roleplay. While it might make sense for the ship to have one, I think the former is a good enough reason not to.

Security is going to be involved with antagonists no matter what we do. No matter what we add/remove/rework, Security will always end up getting in a firefight- or atleast 80% of the time. So why would adding in another option to attack/steal from be such a bad thing? 

This just adds a new target for the antagonist, that will also provide them with rewards that are worth the time. 

Below are scenarios and how they usually play out. They're "spoiled" so they prevent a massive post.

Spoiler

What happens when the Armory is robbed? 
1 - Security cannot deal with the antagonists effectively
2 - The ship is taken over/crew is extorted
3 - Command calls an ERT or the Crew Armory is always opened
4 - Firefight

Spoiler

What happens when the Scuttling device is stolen or tampered with? 
1 - Security is armed to the teeth/Stops from getting armed because they're told the ship will blow up
2 - Command sets code to Red/Green, depending on if the ship is being held hostage
3 - The SCC is informed and is like "Stop them and get it back!!!!"/"We'll send a special team"
4 - Firefight

Spoiler

What happens when the Vault is robbed? 
1 - Security is either on scene immediately/is armed then on scene
2 - Command tells the robbers to give it back/to stop
3 - Interaction takes place and a story of xyz is begun
4 - Firefight. 

Spoiler

But this also is applied to anything else. 
Pharmacy is robbed? 
1 - Security is either on scene immediately/is armed then on scene
2 - Command tells the robbers to give it back/to stop
3 - Interaction takes place and a story of xyz is begun
4 - Firefight. 

My point is, that no matter what we do/add/remove/rework, the formula is there. And because the formula is there, it shouldn't be a reason to prevent something - like a vault - from being added. It'll add another option/goal for attackers, whether it's on-station traitors, or off station pirates. 

And worst case? If it's really really bad? I'll just undo it. But I really think that saying "It'll end in a firefight" is kind of pointless. Almost every antagonist interaction will end in some sort of firefight or combat encounter. 

 

Edited June 26, 2022 by ReadThisNamePlz

[Gem]

i second what Danse said. this is also what i had in mind regarding the scuttling device location when i did my remap.
a vault would be cool though and would fit under the A.I. core.

[Gem]

On 26/06/2022 at 05:51, ReadThisNamePlz said:

A nuclear device, regardless of the activation method, should not be sitting in a public hallway behind a single door. The Captains office has more security than the nuclear bomb. Shoot, even xenobiology does. The command bunker has more isolation than the device that can destroy the ship? I just don't find it very believable.

  in a public hallway, behind reinforced walls, 6 turrets, a highly secured and bolted airlock (that requires captain level access iirc), a blast door that requires captain level access and being on the bridge to open, and its location in the public hallway making it very obvious if someone tries tampering with it whilst also making it easy to defend from boarders due to its location.

[NerdyVampire]

I think good things can come from this, I have faith that it will be of overall benefit to the round