Character Complaint - Vera Crux

[Munks]

BYOND Key: Munks

Game ID: The round immediately before bOF-cVtH

Player Byond Key: ParadoxSpace

Staff involved: N/A

Reason for complaint: At round start, I checked the warehouse on the cameras to see if there were any power cells in it (super/hyper capacity cells tend to spawn inside). I saw Cargo Technician Vera Crux inside pocketing an EMP grenade from a box of them, as well as making a knife blade out of Uranium. I inform Security, and two officers head for Cargo, asking for me to report as backup. I go there, and Crux immediately gets indignant and refuses to be searched, so she is cuffed and forcibly searched. When the contraband is located, she insists it was intended to be sent to CentComm (contradictory to her pocketing a single grenade and trying to put the rest on the shuttle, as well as making a knife out of the uranium having nothing to do with sending it to CentCom)

She is taken to the brig, kicking and screaming about being framed, I'm out of line, etc. While she is being taken, I took the rest of uranium to the Research Director to be used properly. During her stay in the brig, Crux insisted on walking around topless with her tits out and continuing to be inflammatory over comms, informing everyone she will no longer be taking cargo orders for the rest of the shift. When she was released from the brig, she indeed did nothing and sent the entire warehouse back to CentComm instead of distributing. I told her i took the warehouse uranium to Science, and she flipped shit and accused me of theft (even though she was just going to send it back anyway)

Later on, I found a Janitor belt in maint and tried to take it to the janitor. She tried to steal it once and send it back to CentComm for no reason, I flashed her and returned the belt to the janitor while she continued to chase after me. After the janitor took the belt, and I left, Crux informed me that she lied to the janitor and claimed I stole it from her in order to get the Janitor to return it, and then sent the belt to CentComm in retaliation for me getting her arrested for Contraband.

She spent an entire 2 hour round being childish and actively refusing to do an ounce of work, and stealing from people at that, over a lawful arrest as well as one that I was ordered to do. Someone like this would not be working here at all.

Did you attempt to adminhelp the issue at the time? If so, what was the known action taken by administration/moderation? No. I asked an admin if it was possible for silicons to write IC complaints, which was a no, so I'm making it OOC instead.

Approximate Date/Time: ~7pm UTC +01:00 5/26/2017

[Snakebittenn]

Wew, okay.

So the entire round, AERO was being absurdly rude and sassy towards staff, and naturally I'm not going to take that shit from a subservient robot.

I was fully intending to send the EMP grenades off to Security, but I had to change my story to 'to Central' when the Security team showed up. The knife, I intended to keep yes, I wasn't aware there were borgs and an AI breathing down our necks and waiting for us to slip up.

"informing everyone she will no longer be taking cargo orders for the rest of the shift." is a fabrication, I simply intended to send everything in the warehouse back to Central, yes, in order to be petty towards the sassbot. Not to mention I am not obligated to distribute.

I was unaware AERO found the janibelt in the maintenance shafts, as far as I knew he stole yet another item from our warehouse, and I intended to ship it back. I did not steal from anyone, I simply politely asked the janitor.

I would've been more able to do my job, and more willing, if AERO and squad did not show up to secure arrests on me.

Also, I fail to see why you needed to access cameras on the cargo warehouse to see if there were any cells, are you so incapable of asking?

[Munks]

I told you the belt was from maintenance when you informed me you had the janitor give it to you for you to return to central. Your response, over PDA, was "kill yourself". In addition, sure I can ask, but I can also look for myself. I looked over cameras so as not to physically get in the way. I don't see how this exactly is an issue. We just had two rounds in a row where the cargo technicians were absent/not working, I was well within my right to look over cameras for cells and I intended to. This is all irrelevant anyway, because you're just upset I caught you committing a crime and informed Sec.

Also, of note, me being "rude to staff" is a lie as well, because the only one I was in any way negative to was you for your shitty behavior all round, by referring to you as a "delinquent". Which is a professionally used term. Admittedly, I called you an idiot when you were freaking out about us "planting" evidence on you and framing you, which I confess is a step out of line but is absolutely no reason to punish EVERYONE ON THE STATION by actively denying resources.

Finally, yes, you actually are expected to do your job.

 

Try to perform your job to a satisfactory standard, especially in positions of power (security, head roles.) Minor failures at doing so will result in IC consequences, but constant, repeated failures without sense or reason can result in jobbans (NT would probably not hire your character if they were completely unable to do their job). Note that you are not expected to be a role model employee, but are asked to not use your job to grief and to also have an OOC understanding of what’s going on.

 

You not only didn't work, but you sent everything in the warehouse, valuable items included, back to centcomm out of spite. You flat out LIED to someone to get him to hand you over something hugely valuable to his job to send back, and I saw your messages over PDA snarking to a completely unrelated chemist about how they're not going to be getting the chemistry items that were in the warehouse. You would have sent back the uranium too if I didn't give it to the RD, which is probably why you got so pissed off and accused me of theft.

Edited May 26, 2017 by Guest

[Snakebittenn]

I'm upset that you acted more like a 13 year old composed of iron and vinegar than an actual security borg. The arrest was fine, and well justified, your behavior was my main issue. 'Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.' etcetera. If you were going to act like that, I was not going to be cooperative in turn.

[Scheveningen]

I don't understand why you made an OOC complaint over an IC issue, Munks.

 

Staff involved: N/A

 

I mean. Really?

[sonicgotnuked]

I fucking knew this would become a complaint....

Anyway, I was the RD, had to do some stuff, came back as the HoP. This is probably the only round I regretted becoming HoP because the first thing I get was walls of texts from the borg and a complaint with walls of texts, two complete stories on how the beginning of the round unfolded, I honestly thought someone was a traitor or something.

I got the vibe that Paradox escalated the situation by sending every single item to central over something that could be solved simply. I got a claim that they made the knife to see if they can make it.

Like this honestly did not need to go this far and I feel both parties are at fault from what I have put together. There is not really any reason for this entire thing and was probably just a thing to try and one up eachother.

Like come on, I don't understand why this is such a big deal. Maybe it was securities fault rushing in too quickly? It litterly was 15 minutes into the round and there is already a fight.

[Munks]

I don't understand why you made an OOC complaint over an IC issue, Munks.

 

Staff involved: N/A

 

I mean. Really?

 

Did you read past the initial formatting? I asked during the round if silicon units can complain ICly, was told no, so I waited until afterwards to raise a complaint. I've been in more trouble for far less so I don't see why someone should not be complained about for actively denying resources to the entire station the whole round over being arrested at roundstart? Someone like this not ever working aboard a station like this when this is an RP issue is the problem, like i said

[sonicgotnuked]

N/A usually means that it does not imply or non existent. This honestly should of been forgotten about after the round was over.

[Munks]

So are silicon players just generally not allowed to complain about misconduct in the round, then? Because in ahelp i was told silicons can't make much of an IC issue about it, I can't take it OOC during the round because of IC in OOC, and now apparently I can't complain about it OOCly after the round? Again, I have been in trouble for much, much less than refusing to do my job an entire round and outright stealing from people, so why this would get a free pass escapes me.

[Scheveningen]

Because in ahelp i was told silicons can't make much of an IC issue about it, I can't take it OOC during the round because of IC in OOC, and now apparently I can't complain about it OOCly after the round?

 

Did you attempt to adminhelp the issue at the time? If so, what was the known action taken by administration/moderation? No. I asked an admin if it was possible for silicons to write IC complaints, which was a no, so I'm making it OOC instead.

 

These two things you've said sound incredibly out of context, so unless you can produce the exact context of who said that, when, and why, that's not going to be addressed here. So.

Okay, allow me to tell you folks how this usually works.

Someone does a thing in-game. Someone reports it through an adminhelp. Either we take care of it and resolve it oocly and ensure that whoever did a bad will avoid doing it again for the same reasons. Or, we tell the person who reported it that it was an IC issue and they will either A.) Have to deal with it for the rest of the round as it's an IC issue or B.) Take it up to the forums to dispute the decision and press for actual action such as a reprimand of the player or above.

Someone missed a step in the production of this complaint. So don't be surprised if this is going to be dismissed as an IC issue right now, because that's pretty much what it is. It was an IC squabble over contraband that got a little out of hand, but not enough to warrant immediate administration intervention.

Pocketing an EMP grenade and making a uranium knife to also pocket is a security issue. We are not going to ban people for making and pocketing knives. That is what security is for. Take your issues up with them, it is what people play security for, to deal with issues like that. We warn and/or ban people for going over the line in terms of roleplay, which I don't need to explain since it's pretty self-explanatory. In this case, intervention would barely constitute as necessary, especially considering the OP did not attempt to address the issue in an adminhelp beforehand. While against IC law, it does not go against any OOC roleplay standards to be engaging in mild (albeit not on the same level of maliciousness as an antag does) criminal activity and ignoring a few regulations. Much more scrutiny would be exercised if anything happened beyond the person getting arrested and whining about it. Everyone does it when it happens to them, so that's fine. People, or rather more specifically, their characters will learn what rules to start obeying if they want to keep their job.

So yes. That sucks. Crux gets off for doing it in the long-term, but the general idea is that characters do not need to be punished for doing something perceivably wrong ICly to an immense extent that a complaint calls for immediate action upon them. Sucks even more that silicons can't (and shouldn't) try to perceive IC consequences through DO actions. But it is for good reason, as it makes sense. You're a synthetic. Not another petty humanoid personality who has a bone to pick with another humanoid personality whose e-peen threatens the sanctity of your own. Your character has bigger priorities than the drama of biologicals. Your laws in protecting them from hazards take priority. "Protecting someone from themselves", before anyone tries to rebut me on this point, is not a valid precedent to go after someone unless they're literally hurting themselves then and there. I assume you didn't have bigger problems in the round as an AI so that's generally how you occupied the general free amount of time you had.

 

Again, I have been in trouble for much, much less than refusing to do my job an entire round and outright stealing from people, so why this would get a free pass escapes me.

 

I wouldn't consider having a provocative and aggressive attitude both ICly and OOCly as smaller issues than a cargo tech who pocketed an EMP grenade of all things and shipped back the entire contents of the cargo warehouse (which is not even a bad thing at all, I've no idea why this is taboo to anyone, just because Nanako rolled antag items in there for antags to steal doesn't mean they're obligated to be there 24/7 throughout the entire round just for them, you snooze you lose) to CentComm. Just throwing it out there if you were confused as to why we're more hesitant to step into a situation that does not really mandate after-the-fact judgment.

Cruz's behavior was petty, but amazingly enough there are just as equally petty people in real life. The worst part about fiction in writing is that unlike reality, fiction has to make sense. In this case their behavior was more or less justified. From their point of view they were pissed they got arrested over such a small thing despite having lied about it. Some people get pissed being caught in a lie.

A lot of this hubbub could've been avoided if communication attempts were made to staff if this was that big of a problem to you. Because otherwise, I don't know what to tell you besides saying there is nothing we're willing to do for such a small issue that should have been handled in IC, and then let go upon the round ending.

[Eternias]

Hey there. I was directly involved as one of the two Security personnel who were on-scene to respond when the AI and AERO reported the cargo technician pocketing contraband and, this is the important part, Creating it. Crux's character lied about having dangerous items on them when we tried to search her after getting a warrant, which i discovered when i found the Uranium Concealed Knife she created, hidden in her bag.

I was then talked to by i believe it was Albyerk (I'm sorry for the terrible spelling, i stumbled across the thread and am trying to provide clarity), about searching cargo and how they're allowed contraband in the warehouse, which i was fine with, but i was both: Following orders from an officer who was with me, and; responding to the real threat of not just 'moving contraband to central' but, creating the contraband itself from raw materials, which i see as a much bigger threat to the station. A cargo technician actually manufacturing weapons out of radioactive materials? She also did proceed to openly say she'd not aid any department with supplies from cargo.

Aside from that, Crux did continue to do things like reveal her breasts, make inappropriate noises and such, but that can be justified IRP with relative ease. That's all i'm aware of on Crux's side.

On AERO's side, he did behave in a manner not fit of synthetics, to which he's seemed to have already admitted. Why I was Ahelpped on, but not AERO, i'm unsure, as the AI and AERO were the one to originally find and report the crimes that took place, but regardless.

I do believe AERO diddn't respond in a manner fit of a Synthetic, though he's seemed to change his ways with a new model of AERO in more recent rounds. I also believe Crux was definitely in the wrong, especially since she did manufacture contraband herself, and she openly stated she'd not aid other departments by doing her job.

That's really the two main points for both of them, though i don't know why it had to be brought up here.

[Munks]

Pocketing an EMP grenade and making a uranium knife to also pocket is a security issue. We are not going to ban people for making and pocketing knives. That is what security is for.

 

She spent an entire 2 hour round being childish and actively refusing to do an ounce of work, and stealing from people at that, over a lawful arrest as well as one that I was ordered to do. Someone like this would not be working here at all.

I summarized this at the end of my complaint because that is the subject of my complaint, not the Security issues which were provided as background as to why they spent the rest of the round doing what they did.

 

Cruz's behavior was petty, but amazingly enough there are just as equally petty people in real life. The worst part about fiction in writing is that unlike reality, fiction has to make sense. In this case their behavior was more or less justified. From their point of view they were pissed they got arrested over such a small thing despite having lied about it. Some people get pissed being caught in a lie.

It seems like a lot of your issue with me complaining about this is that you seem to think someone would be unscathed if they were working a shipping/receiving job and decided to stop working and no longer distribute any already-received materials to their intended destination, because they're just being "petty" in the workplace or something. If this is the case I'm not really sure what to tell you other than I guess there's not much point pursuing this further. Feel free to close this.

[Butterrobber202]

Was present in the round as Iko Usos, Crux literally got caught red-handed, fingers in the pie, and still went on a rampage on Sec claiming that she was totally right, and when in the Brig, she rolled down the jumpsuit to flaunt her boobs at people walking by. Acted extremely unprofessional and the like, but if feel that this should be a CCIA thing, not a OOC thing.

[Scheveningen]

Closing upon request.