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[Resolved] Schevenigen


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BYOND Key: XanderDox

Staff BYOND Key: [mention]Scheveningan[/mention]

Game ID: FORUMS (https://forums.aurorastation.org/viewtopic.php?f=23&p=83568#p83568)

Reason for complaint: Threatening to Abuse Staff Powers and General Rudeness

Evidence/logs/etc: See the link above in Game ID and Below


Additional remarks:


Threatening Abuse of Powers


"Furthermore, I assume you know the rules and I also assume you know better than to drag issues right out where everyone can see, so I'll put this bluntly. Break the forum rules again and act like a dick again you'll be forumbanned. Full stop." - Quote from Link


Essentially, a shitposter had posted something silly, basically saying 'Rebel against Garn' , I found this cute and quaint and reminiscent of my own anti-Garn speech from pre-Ban Xander, so I commented something along the lines of 'Would you get a load of this guy?" and @'d our lovely Headmin, Garnascus. I then received a discord message from Scheveningen tell me not to respond to shit posters - I found this funny, because our lovely headmin responded shortly after me, addressing these shitposters. Shev then said he does not care what Garn does: What this does for me is makes me feel that admins/mods are for some reason, allowed to break the rules that we are held too, but oh well - I ignored him and didn't pay much mind to it. I then in the thread linked above, told Shev jokingly to not tell me what to do like that again, it is very evident I was joking. Shev then took his 'cock' as Skull132 would phrase in leadership class, and waved it around, saying he would ban me from the forums. This is outright threatning to abuse his powers to permanently remove me from the server forums, for something our Headmin did to an extent great than even I did.


Please also note the irony highlight in the above statement - He says I should know better than to drag things into public, yet he consistently does it to me. I do not think he is fit to be a moderator.


Related Discord Message

>

General Rudeness


Shev has also been generally antagonistic (as he always has been - this has stopped him from being accepted as Mod before, and has always been something the community is aware of) towards me during my journey back into this community, I was graciously given the chance to rejoin by our Head Admin Garn, and in the words of many players and even staff here, I have made great progress in re-assimilating myself into the server and community, however when staff of all people continue to publicly drag me through the mud in public channels, it makes it incredibly hard to try to rebuild a public image that is already very tattered.


Discord Message when Shev's Trial Finished

*I had not contacted him for two months prior to this, he messaged me out of the blue purposefully, to harass me.

4e7affdb70.png

 

General Aurora Discord Harassment from the General Channel

*Note, the players were not even discussing me - they were talking about a character Xander, but Delta assumed they were discussing me and chimed in regardless.

div><div class="ipsSpoiler_contents"><p>[img]<a href=https://puu.sh/xbaPY/0024b80d15.png' alt='0024b80d15.png'>

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Discord Message when Shev's Trial Finished

*I had not contacted him for two months prior to this, he messaged me out of the blue purposefully, to harass me.

 

You're trivializing actual victims of harassment by thinking that a private message criticizing you over whatever happened in February, whether it was the ACN or whichever, somehow constitutes as harassment.

 

General Aurora Discord Harassment from the General Channel

*Note, the players were not even discussing me - they were talking about a character Xander, but Delta assumed they were discussing me and chimed in regardless.

 

A general comment from a month and a half ago, which, by the way, was not about the "character", but was about you. Yes they were talking about you, Klaus Eliade is your character, you confused Zelm with your statements.

 

_616fbd9a9bb32971577ecd891409de2a-png.jpg.


Context of the image posted by another user highlighting your own behavior, which is not new, and stretches far back to the beginning of your playtime here on this server.


You don't get to cry about assholes in the community when you act like one to other people. You've done more harassing than those people even deserve by themselves.

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_616fbd9a9bb32971577ecd891409de2a-png.jpg.


Context of the image posted by another user highlighting your own behavior, which is not new, and stretches far back to the beginning of your playtime here on this server.


You don't get to cry about assholes in the community when you act like one to other people. You've done more harassing than those people even deserve by themselves.

 

I do not play cult constructs. End of story, I do not enjoy playing them - And I play this game for ENJOYMENT. Those individuals rushed me and killed me in maintenance, which only added to my decision to no longer play with them, I encouraged admins when in dead chat to give a ghost the chance to fill the construct - But I will not be forced to play something I do not enjoy on a GAME.


Next, I have done little to no harassing of any of these people, I complain about a lot of players here, to select individuals in private. You as a STAFF MEMBER are not meant to join in on shit flinging contests, it is unprofessional, and not fit of a moderator.

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Whatever your definition of harassment is, seems to be skewed, so assuming I'm using your definition of it, lemme provide something in perspective before you proceed to call the kettle black, Mr. Pots.


Last time, on total drama Discord, episode #code_dungeon.

 

XanderDox - Last Thursday at 8:04 PM

So Im looking at the null rod code

are wizard spells supposed to not work if cast at someone holding the rod

        user << "<span class='warning'>You cannot cast spells in null space!</span>"
206    
207        if(spell_flags & Z2NOCAST && (user_turf.z in config.admin_levels)) //Certain spells are not allowed on the centcomm zlevel
…    
210        if(spell_flags & CONSTRUCT_CHECK)
211            for(var/turf/T in range(holder, 1))
212                if(findNullRod(T))
213                    return 0
214    
Also, this is in null rod code

if(LAZYLEN(user.spell_list))
       user.silence_spells(300) //30 seconds
       user << "<span class='danger'>You've been silenced!</span>"
       return

what does that mean^^^

@Lohikar I summon the

thee

veraknocks - Last Thursday at 8:06 PM

you meme on magical people

thats it

congrats

garn what - Last Thursday at 8:07 PM

@XanderDox what do you think silence means(edited)

wtf

veraknocks - Last Thursday at 8:07 PM

good sentence

XanderDox - Last Thursday at 8:07 PM

Okay but

Garn What

it's directly in the null rod's code DM

but Ive never seen a null rod silence someone

ever

veraknocks - Last Thursday at 8:07 PM

because its directly the null rod's purpose

to counter wizard dudes

and meme on cult

garn what - Last Thursday at 8:07 PM

you have to hit the wizard with it

XanderDox - Last Thursday at 8:07 PM

Hitting a wizard stops them from speaking?

veraknocks - Last Thursday at 8:08 PM

no it stops their spells

Lohikar - Last Thursday at 8:08 PM

Stops spells, not speech.

XanderDox - Last Thursday at 8:08 PM

Jesus christ there needs to be ag uide to this

garn what - Last Thursday at 8:08 PM

are you even reading the code you just pasted

XanderDox - Last Thursday at 8:08 PM

I dont

understand

veraknocks - Last Thursday at 8:08 PM

he's got too much hair in his eyes

garn what - Last Thursday at 8:08 PM

>>> user.silence_spells(300)

XanderDox - Last Thursday at 8:08 PM

it

fully

garn what - Last Thursday at 8:08 PM

holy fuck

XanderDox - Last Thursday at 8:08 PM

Can you fuck off

garn what - Last Thursday at 8:08 PM

do you have functioning eyes or what

XanderDox - Last Thursday at 8:08 PM

thanks

So if a wizard casts a spell at someone holding a null rod, like a fireball, will it work? Or is the thing in the first part I posted a check to see if they've been silenced to cancel the spell out that way?

veraknocks - Last Thursday at 8:09 PM

you

hit

them

spells

dont

work

for

some

time

afterwards

cast

spells

freely

XanderDox - Last Thursday at 8:09 PM

this is a second question

Lohikar - Last Thursday at 8:09 PM

can you fucking not

veraknocks - Last Thursday at 8:09 PM

xander have you played any game besides ss13 in your life

XanderDox - Last Thursday at 8:09 PM

Like god I'm seriously fucking just asking a question because no, certain thinks aren't clear to me, you guys dont need to be fucking cunts about it.

veraknocks - Last Thursday at 8:10 PM

no look at it literally says what it does

garn what - Last Thursday at 8:10 PM

personally i'm just saying it was literally right there in the code

veraknocks - Last Thursday at 8:10 PM

it LITERALLY says silenced for 30 seconds

XanderDox - Last Thursday at 8:10 PM

We have tons of shit in the code that literally does not work anymore or I've never seen in game actually work.

veraknocks - Last Thursday at 8:10 PM

aaaaaaaaaand

garn what - Last Thursday at 8:11 PM

i'm not sure if there's an obvious message for a wizard getting silenced

so it's no miracle you've never seen it happen

veraknocks - Last Thursday at 8:11 PM

well i mean

its actually saying in that snip that you're being told you're silenced

garn what - Last Thursday at 8:11 PM

well yeah the wizard gets that

but again i'm js xander it was right there in the code

your second question was a fair one

i do apologise for implying you were blind but

 

If the above behavior coming from you isn't "harassing" then whatever I said to you from more than a month and a half ago, and then seven months ago in your other example, is not harassing either.

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b1816b83a6.jpg

 

This picture and this statement is all I have to say to your response.


In this incident, I am referring to harassment as un-required mentioning of me as a person and individualin order to insult me, and contacting me in order to insult me. The incident on server required no bitching in discord from anyone, especially not a staff member.


I was bumrushed in maint by a juggernaut and cultist and got insta-killed, they had multiple chances to talk with me, and it was refused, so I accused them of rushing me to powergame and not actually wanting to focus on RP - I then ghosted from the soulstone because I do not play cult constructs, if I do end up playing a cult construct, it is due to excellent roleplay leading up to it, which encourages me to join into the story being told, otherwise I want no part of being a cyborg with less powers with no free will.

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In addition, those two were intentionally attempting to aggravate me, my words were responses, I asked Lohikar a question, and they decided to pipe

in, while yes the answers to my questions may have been obvious to them, I myself do not have a knowledge of code, I did not know whether silence was literal, or a reference pulling from somewhere else.

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Just wanted to throw in my two cents- I have only once on my entire time on this server had a guy not ghost upon being soul stoned.


It is not new or shocking, I'm pretty sure even I would ghost if I was made one. No one should HAVE to RP any scenarios they dont like or did not ask for at all, and should have the option to leave or ghost in these situations, IE being tortured, etc.


Aside from that, and stop me if I'm overstepping my boundaries, but holy shit I am upset at the guys in the code dungeon. I'll be having a talk with each of them later to inform them that the whitey dont abide.


That said just because they were being massive little cunts doesn't mean relativity dictates you guys have nothing happening between you. You are both clearly not fans of one another and I can see the logic in that reasoning given your history. However, Delta, you are a mod now, and should be above this in the name of good taste. Relativity because of other people being cunts doesn't really excuse that, you feel me? I get that this may come off as hypocrism because I'm telling you other people doing things doesn't excuse you doing it and it and then immediately saying "well EVERYONE ghosts when theyre soul sharded" but with that said, being a dick in lieu of others doing the same is far less excusable than rage quitting cause you got epically pwned in lieu of others leaving cause they also did.


I think Xander has made a genuine effort to be better than he was. Ive seen his attempts myself and I am proud. Him falling through by ghosting because he doesnt want to roleplay as something that hes incapable of getting into isnt that much of an offense, and more just a rage quit, which everyone does and is allowed to do. He COULD probably keep the LOOC smack to himself, but its not all that emotive in comparison to the other stuff I've seen people say when sharded. *shrug

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I was bumrushed in maint by a juggernaut and cultist and got insta-killed, they had multiple chances to talk with me, and it was refused, so I accused them of rushing me to powergame and not actually wanting to focus on RP - I then ghosted from the soulstone because I do not play cult constructs, if I do end up playing a cult construct, it is due to excellent roleplay leading up to it, which encourages me to join into the story being told, otherwise I want no part of being a cyborg with less powers with no free will.

 

Feel free to remove this post because it may appear to be irrelevant to the current case and I may have no "say" in what happens next after my testimony. I was present during this case and I'll testify as an attacker along with juggernaut and Hashu. Xander was not "bumrushed"/powergamed. We had planned for this to happen. Although, you ghosted the moment you were sharded. You took IC issues to LOOC. The cultists were unhappy with the result and I do remember you were spoken to by Garn on both cases. However... On good faith, I believe that this should not be used against to shoot down Xander's reasoning in this staff complaint, and staff complaint should only be focused on Delta's behavior, not Xander's otherwise make a player complaint against Xander.

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In addition, those two were intentionally attempting to aggravate me, my words were responses, I asked Lohikar a question, and they decided to pipe

in, while yes the answers to my questions may have been obvious to them, I myself do not have a knowledge of code, I did not know whether silence was literal, or a reference pulling from somewhere else.

 

Oh okay, so telling them to fuck off while on a hair trigger anyway, with your history of attitude that you've been repeatedly hollered at by staff about, was totally justified, and you had no other response to give that was more polite, I'm sure you had nothing but good intentions by responding like an asshole to other people being frank with you and telling you to actually think what code language means. It is notoriously literal.


You are psychologically projecting your own arguably worse social issues and assuming I suffer from the same ones. I find it really funny that I invoke tu quoque first by its origin phrase, "pot calling the kettle black", and then you try to turn it on me to sound smart? You are committing tu quoque, not I. In Matthew 7:3-5, it is criticism of a less significant failing by those who are worse that is the target of the Sermon on the Mount: "Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?"


It is actually important to think about these things and how they apply to you before you go around accusing people willy-nilly of nonsense. I have recently permabanned a community member who thought it intelligent discourse to accuse everyone of lying while all of the proof that existed in the complaints, were evidence that the person themselves were wrong. Their attitude was extremely freaking shitty. I have zero obligation to mince words with someone with a history of viciously harassing other players, and exploding at the tiniest microaggression and claiming the slight was the worst possible offense against you. You're incredibly sensitive and your ego's fragile as heck. This shows in discussions with you OOCly and your characters appear to be on the same emotional hair trigger ICly. You outright do not care to see the effect of your interactions on other community members, if you did care you would've stopped being an alarmist, reactionary asshole by now. There is no reason for you to be flipping out at anyone like you do. What is your excuse for it, even? I will not apologize for doing my job and nipping malicious shitposting in the bud.

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You where PMed by delta about your shitposted before i had made my statement about shitposting. Specifically when it is and isnt ok to do so.

 

This basically.


The key phrase here is "within reason". First off the Russian spammers and the various shoe adds that keep appearing here might as well be magic. I have no idea why they keep coming back or how they are getting past our impenetrable hacker wall but they are. Those posts i just delete on sight and if someone has shitposted that is fine too i guess. they are going to keep coming back regardless. If i am being completely honest i think THAT is kind of an aurora meme at this point.


Second off if someone wants to come to the server just to grief or fuck around and then if they want to shitpost about the ban and their "glorious revolution" i will happily make a show of banning them. Come to me with an appeal or even a hint of remorse and i will do my best to help you out. Hell even if you're flaming us and pissed off i will STILL remain professional because at least there you CARE ENOUGH about the server to be angry about being banned from it. We escalate punishments accordingly based on history and intent. The exception to this are griefers who are permanently banned on sight.

 


That is my opinion as head administrator and the post xander made on that thread is well within the guidelines i have established.

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Oh okay, so telling them to fuck off while on a hair trigger anyway, with your history of attitude that you've been repeatedly hollered at by staff about, was totally justified, and you had no other response to give that was more polite, I'm sure you had nothing but good intentions by responding like an asshole to other people being frank with you and telling you to actually think what code language means. It is notoriously literal.


You are psychologically projecting your own arguably worse social issues and assuming I suffer from the same ones. I find it really funny that I invoke tu quoque first by its origin phrase, "pot calling the kettle black", and then you try to turn it on me to sound smart? You are committing tu quoque, not I. In Matthew 7:3-5, it is criticism of a less significant failing by those who are worse that is the target of the Sermon on the Mount: "Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?"


It is actually important to think about these things and how they apply to you before you go around accusing people willy-nilly of nonsense. I have recently permabanned a community member who thought it intelligent discourse to accuse everyone of lying while all of the proof that existed in the complaints, were evidence that the person themselves were wrong. Their attitude was extremely freaking shitty. I have zero obligation to mince words with someone with a history of viciously harassing other players, and exploding at the tiniest microaggression and claiming the slight was the worst possible offense against you. You're incredibly sensitive and your ego's fragile as heck. This shows in discussions with you OOCly and your characters appear to be on the same emotional hair trigger ICly. You outright do not care to see the effect of your interactions on other community members, if you did care you would've stopped being an alarmist, reactionary asshole by now. There is no reason for you to be flipping out at anyone like you do. What is your excuse for it, even? I will not apologize for doing my job and nipping malicious shitposting in the bud.

 

I am discarding your first paragraph here - because once again, THIS COMPLAINT IS NOT ABOUT ME, IT IS ABOUT YOU AND THE PROVIDED CIRCUMSTANCES IN WHICH I BELIEVE YOU BEHAVED WRONGLY. ONLY CONTEXT DIRECTLY RELATED TO THE SITUATIONS I LISTED SHOULD BE INVOLVED. Thank you.


Your next paragraph is also being ignored? Why? Because:

 

You are psychologically projecting your own arguably worse social issues and assuming I suffer from the same ones. I find it really funny that I invoke tu quoque first by its origin phrase, "pot calling the kettle black", and then you try to turn it on me to sound smart? You are committing tu quoque, not I. In Matthew 7:3-5, it is criticism of a less significant failing by those who are worse that is the target of the Sermon on the Mount: "Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye?"

 

Is blatant ad-hominem, how DARE you ever assume or try to argue I am suffering from social issues that I am projecting - I am NOT committing tu quoque, WHY? Because this complaint is literally ABOUT YOU, and EVERYTHING YOU DO WRONG, is ENTIRELY RELATED to THIS COMPLAINT. The subject is not ME the subject is not US, the subject is YOU and YOUR BEHAVIOUR. I take incredible offense to the implication I am suffering from some sort of psychological or social issue - We have rules about being polite, but I'm kindly going to give you a fuck you here for saying what you did there, since you blatantly have also failed to follow forum rules regarding ad-hominem here - I think I have some leeway to say that (admins feel free to edit it out if now). For reference, the ad hominem rule states:

 

Do not use ad hominem. This means do not attack a person's character (character in this case meaning the mental and moral qualities distinctive to an individual). You are expected to argue the presented ideas, not the person. If someone were to attack you, don’t take matters into your own hands, report it to us.

 

And I'm not discussing your third paragraph because you're just bringing up Briabri, who isn't related to this complaint at all, and you're also insulting me by calling me a reactionary asshole. So, please kindly respond properly to my points and I will hope to get a response to you as is reasonable within my schedule.

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I will not apologize for doing my job and nipping malicious shitposting in the bud.

 

One more thing. Your Head Admin gave a statement on this in your thread, and you still for some reason standby that you are on the moral high ground of doing your job - No. If your supervisor does not see an issue with something under the rules, than there is no issue with something under the rules. Interpretation and application of the rules ultimately falls to administrators, and more importantly the head administrators, especially when said interpretation is permanently embedded on the forums. Threatening to ban me for conduct the head admin literally had just expressed is NOT an offense is really laughable.

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THIS COMPLAINT IS NOT ABOUT ME, IT IS ABOUT YOU AND THE PROVIDED CIRCUMSTANCES IN WHICH I BELIEVE YOU BEHAVED WRONGLY. ONLY CONTEXT DIRECTLY RELATED TO THE SITUATIONS I LISTED SHOULD BE INVOLVED. Thank you.

 

Note that you were not given forum warnings, nor discord warnings or the like on-server. Note that any statements made prior to Garn outlining whatever in the thread I made, were made after I told you off. So nothing else can be done retroactively beyond me telling you, "Okay, just kidding, pranked you hard there, I'll just abide by whatever guidelines the head admin states now." Since it wasn't clarified before. So the way I dealt with you (if it can be called that beyond passive-aggressive conversations that didn't last beyond a few lines, which is seemingly common between the both of us anyway?) was simply because I had no particular basis to work off of someone 'peanut posting' (basically, alongside other people, adding something not of particular worth and appears enough inflammatory that it could cause the guy to reply, had we not banned the guy quicker).

 

Threatening to ban me for conduct the head admin literally had just expressed is NOT an offense is really laughable.

 

Okay, hold your laughter there. It wasn't a threat. It was a guarantee provided you decided to go on and post like I warned you to not post in such a fashion, i.e. posting in worse faith than the original poster. As you know, you're on thin ice even after your unban and repeat offenses even under sketchier conditions, for the person who is repeating the offense, aren't particularly tolerated. A threat implies it's empty words being said to try and deter you from saying anything.


Even taking into consideration what Garn said was fair game, you're probably better off not replying though you're not strictly disallowed. That was the point there. So, what this mean? Absolutely nothing. Retroactively nothing can be done, my word was overridden by an admin, and you weren't handed out a sliver of punishment. The matter you take issue with, in particular, was the matter of me "threatening" the ban. In particular, I made mention of that because you of all people should know when to control their temper and how they should respond to people. Garn's putting a lot of faith in you and I may not like it but I may as well damn respect it. So it's in your interest to not go further than where you've gone in this thread here.


You do have a habit of flipping out at people, do you not have a history of that? Do you not see why people would be cautious in dealing with you, especially when you come out of left field with that original post there? Were you really surprised that you were dished something that you tried and dish first?


Not that my response was justified. Looking back, it was a frustrated reply and it added absolutely nothing useful. I'm still adamant in believing you really need to chill out and avoid overcomplicating threads like I was outlining to be very bad to be participating in, and I also should respect when not to respond in the same manner to an extreme post like that in the same respect, because it seems like when the either of us come into play in 'discussion', for no particular reason it gets awfully personal and I'd rather not dwell on that nonsense from now on.


As to the accusation of rudeness, pretty much not a lot I can say. Whatever people constitute as rude is a very flexible definition, if I offend by getting straight to the point and being frank then as part of my personal way of doing things, I won't really apologize for it. It keeps me on edge, properly able to respond and deal with an issue with a sense of urgency and dedication. Since I consider those things more of a virtue than being super squeaky nice and clean and sensitive, that's generally what you're going to get even if you have a distaste for it.


And yeah, I flew off the handle calling you an asshole. You do tend to exaggerate and act alarmist to certain issues that demand more caution rather than it being thrown to the wind, otherwise you're going to be hollered at back so that you actually hear something that isn't fueled by your own irritations. I do have a distaste for the way you respond to issues, especially in which, displayed in the OP particularly, you have a penchant for invoking the mention of genitalia for some reason to drive your point? Which is not something I particularly resonate with. Since mama raised me the way I am, I did think it, albeit incorrectly, appropriate to holla back with the same intensity. Wrong, yes, but already established.


As for the other screenshots you seem to have held onto for a long time. Why did you hold onto them for that long? Why did you even use them as an attempt at proving something? One is from, like, February (7 months ago), from either whatever happened with the ACN or the minecraft server or whatever you did to piss off GarnItzal at the time to earn the permaban. The next one was a statement that was said out of turn, I admit. From a month and a half ago. So that's almost five to six months of in-between there that you held onto. Everything else I've already covered. If you wanted to prove the two of us clearly have some underlying sexual tension personal issues going on, you sure proved it. Not much else can be garnered there.

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I didn't save screenshots, the conversation history has remained the entire time, although 'puush', my screenshot service, saves a backup of my screenshots to an online repository.


The prelude to the first message back in February where you randomly messaged me was talking about HunterRS - You had asked me why I put up with him because he had been throwing a fit on the Minecraft server, I explained I had not banned him/punished him yet as I was trying to be nice.


You then messaged me three months later with the response that you did. The reason I've shared that one despite it's age, is that it occurred just after your trial had ended, and as you began your moderatorship.


Anyways - I can clearly see that you and I having a back and forth here isn't going to lead to anything beneficial - So it would perhaps be better to await for an administrator or head administrator's response.

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You then messaged me three months later with the response that you did. The reason I've shared that one despite it's age, is that it occurred just after your trial had ended, and as you began your moderatorship.

 

It seems it was around the period you were permabanned. I do not really remember what you did to get it without opening a whole new dusty book to figure out what it was that warranted the response.

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Delta could have definitely responded to this complaint better. The main issue in the OP has already been cleared up and while the screenshots you list are problematic they are very old. I do not really think its fair to save up issues with a person and then dump them all some time in the future. Added to that myself, abosh and delta recently had a conversation. Various issues where addressed and his conduct was one of them. Essentially its something we've already dealt with. That being said i really cannot condone how delta responded to this. staff complaints ideally exist as a dialogue between a staff member and a player. if a reasonable outcome cannot be reached then a higher up steps in and settles it. All that was really needed here was one post from delta somewhere along the lines of "i did what i thought was ok at the time and i am taking steps to improve on X"


Hopefully in the future that is how this will go from now on. hopefully xander will report issues to another staff member when they initially crop up and not weeks or months from then. Unless there is anything else i will consider this resolved.

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