Kaed

Yeah after getting some sleep I'm not sure what about your response set me off so much, maybe I just was sleepy not in a memey mood, because there was practically smoke coming out of my ears when I wrote that and I had to revise it several times to be less overtly rude. Anyway, I'll give PoZe a poke.

That doesn't even make sense in this context. I'm not actually asking you a question. What?? No seriously, you can't just use 'find out ICly' as an out of context response to everything, including statements of intent. I'll take then that you're not interested in the idea, because you're just giving a nonsense troll response.

How about I do you one better and also give full dionae a super chirp which will be a remixed version where there's like five or six nymphs chirping at once in a cricket cacophony.

I frankly don't see a reason why we need to grandfather here. This process (IPCs becoming heads) has become very unmonitored and slipshod, just make everyone start fresh. If they earned the right to do ti in the past, they should be able to again in the future. IPC players can just deal with it.

I'm for IPC laws, but considering how much people scream bloody murder every time they get culted or vamp thralled or dominated I doubt that is going to be a realistic possibility. Even outside of IPCs, people get knee jerk mad about 'being told how their character can be played'. It's more likely to be some sort of tag or other visual identifier.

Considering that you and I are very often at odds in almost any conversation we have, I'll just have to assume we have wildly different ideologies on how things should be. I'll give you a few pointer bits mine about some of the things you just said. -The unpopularity of changeling means nothing here, it was just the easiest example to come up with because I've watched it happen recently. -I have been very specific about IPCs not needing a mechanical nerf. They're fine the way they are, just don't put them in the HoS position and I'll be good. I'd like they out of all head positions, but I am capable of being realistic about my goals. -You have an IPC whitelist yourself, so you have some preconceived bias already. This is perhaps understandable, given how IPCs have been given so many extra privileges that their players now feel they deserve them. Centurion makes a perfectly fine officer, I've seen them play that. -There absolutely needs to be a visual notifier, what the actual fuck are you talking about. If an entire race can be either free or a servant depending on circumstances, you need a way to easily know which is which so you can respect their respective rights, or lack thereof. Do you expect robot slavery to be on the honor system? That has definitely how slavery has always worked historically, you have to ask the slave if they are a slave to be sure. No one has ever had to live their live in shackles with a stigmatizing artifact like a collar or slave brand. -I'm not opposed in the least to the rights of robots (or any race, really) changing over time, as long as things can get better or worse later. The most frustrating thing about this server's ideologies seems to be that they cling to the rewards and civil rights treats forever but let the bad stuff go eventually. IPCs have been gaining more and more privileges over the last few years to the point where we have people actually saying there shouldn't be any difference between free and owned IPCs, and people should just have to ask them to find out. They used to be this race that were barely people and abused and now everyone is basically expected to just let the robo-racism be on their own initiative, with no actual backing in how the robots are permitted to do things, because they get everything everyone else does. You can't even abuse them anymore except verbally because laws protect them.

Oh, you meant earlier in the thread. Yes, I'm happy about that. But I'm still able to complain a little to garn about my feelings on things coming to this point!

That's why I paraphrased instead of including the entire conversation.

This is basically the problem I have with the way things have developed. There's no conflict to being an IPC, they're just reskinned humans that are harder to kill. Because you've given them all these civil rights treats, IPC players now feel they deserve them, and @Senpai Jackboot is essentially afraid to take anything away because he doesn't want to upset players. In his own words, paraphrased, "If I were an IPC head and suddenly couldn't be one anymore, Id hate it and stop playing." It should always have been a temporary gain that later got swept under the rug when it no longer became political expedient, perhaps due to some scandal or attack by robot insurgents turning the public opinion away from them.

On their regulations...?

I just spoke with an IPC player in game, named Hammer Down (another HoS robot), via LOOC. This is in fact what IPCs seem to believe are their rights in game. This doesn't match up with what you are saying, @DronzTheWolf. Which is the correct answer here? If they are wrong about this, why has it not been adequately communicated to them? Additionally, I don't really understand by what means 'this IPC is free' is conveyed to players in game. It seems to be an entirely player-based RP condition, unable to be determined in game without asking them, according to this conversation Again, if this is incorrect, why do we have people who are both head of staff and IPC whitelisted saying this? If the charges are different between 'free' and 'not free' IPCs, there should be some way to tell.

-- me being salty, have since calmed down --

It's difficult to do this without fundamentally changing how IPCs work. They don't have a reason why they should feel pain. I don't think they need to be changed. I think regulations need to be changed so they are not so easy to abuse. They're already the strongest race in combat, they don't need to also be given as much authority and toys as they want in combat situations.

I explained the reasons in my original post why it is causing problems. IPC HoS's can 1v1 a changeling who has arm blades, for instance, because they are utterly immune to pain, and even if the ling kills them somehow, they can't impersonate them or gain their DNA, negating a large part of the entire purpose of the antagonist. There's more to making decisions about who should be allowed where than IC political stuff, gameplay progression matters. Also, talking of lore stuff - it's still utterly inexplicable to me why someone who is not a person in canon, and is treated as property can order around people in departments who, legally speaking, are more qualified than them to lead on account of being people. You jumped the gun straight from 'nonperson who is only useful for serving people' to 'can order people around now lol because they helped out in some event'. You can break your robot head of staff and not be charged with murder now, and you just kind of gloss over that, stubbornly citing that it was the result of a contest, like it's some sacred compact effective into eternity no matter how little sense it makes. Where is the conflict here? You have given these robots authority without giving anything backing it. They don't even need to get an approval from a real head of staff like certain vaurca do, it was just crammed down the throats of everyone who doesn't play IPC and we're expected to just accept it in canon despite the inherent issues. And now it's just a stagnant decision, old news, that you're refusing to consider changing because it's some kind of 'hallmark' of the server? You know what would actually cause conflict? Giving robots a reason to protest their rights being taken away. There is really nothing oppressing robots right now other than some tagging thing that I don't think I've seen anyone care about for months. They had their fun in the sun, time for something to happen that makes things get shittier for them. That's how stuff is supposed to work in arc-based storytelling, people don't just get to live happily ever after forever because some of them did a good once.

It was a bad landmark moment, Jackboot, and it's causing issues. You can easily create some new lore reason for it, especially since the 'reason' for it was largely an arbitrary OOC contest.

There was a time when IPCs couldn't be any kind of head, and by IC legal standards, heads aren't even really people, they are station property. There was apparently some kind of antag event or whatever over a year ago that changed that (way too fast, I might add, they just let IPCs be anything they wanted but captain overnight), but it's been long enough that we can reasonably change things again. Policies change, rewards eventually expire. Personally, I'd like them to go back to being 'no robot heads', but realistically, the only robot heads that are an actual problem in any sense are robot HoS. The head of security is an extremely important part of any antagonist round, well equipped and possessing great command authority... and yet for a great deal of different antagonists - cultists, changelings, vampires most wizards - they are all but immune to most of their abilities. You can't viably subvert them, they're almost impossible to kill without dying first unless you have exactly the right equipment or tools, and most robot HoS's I see do not play as particularly reasonable individuals that you can negotiate with. I'm sure that there are reasonable ones, but it's still playing the most combat oriented head of staff in what is basically the powergame race. I'd really super like it if we cut back on that and pulled that privilege, because I feel it is being abused and was never really good for the game in the first place.

I would strongly prefer an ability to mute ghosts/observers to taking away their ability to LOOC. I do not wish to punish an entire group, just give people an option to not have to listen to them.

Shouldn't have to rely on the staff team for everything. This is just a simple quality of life feature, not a request to punish people for talking in looc

It would be kind of nice if players had a little more control over looc chatter, because sometimes it's important to convey some LOOC information to someone you're actually roleplaying with, but if you leave it on, you also have to listen to whatever chatter is going on between some ghost and a player or whatever. Or you have OOC peole heckling you about your roleplay constantly, or being salty at you because you killed them and you're an antag. Maybe being able to turn off LOOC selectively somehow would be nice? Possibly just from ghosts/nonplayers/corpses

In an attempt to compromise, I have returned the food tagging feature, but it now only indicates that the renamed is a personal recipe, rather than magically conveying knowledge of what the original item is called. Also, I used to boolean variables to make produce and ice cream cones stop having the tag entirely.

No, I am removing specifically the bit that, after you rename your sandwich "Lil' Miss Sloppy" says "You recognize this as Sandwich, but a little piece of paper propped up on it indicates it's a Lil' Miss Sloppy."

https://github.com/Aurorastation/Aurora.3/pull/5751 A semi-recent feature implemented a function that caused food items whose name was not standard to have an extra description that indicates what you recognize the food item as normally. This somewhat took trust and creative liberty away from the player in addition to causing the unintended side effect of causing procedurally generated items like vegetables and ice cream cones from the cart to all have a tag informing you that you recognize them as 'fruit' or 'ice cream cone' but a tag on them indicates they are are a 'cabbage' or 'cherry ice cream cone'. I made a PR removing this feature to fix both issues. There has been some push back that this is a necessary feature in the kitchen, so I will present my defense on removing it here: The onus of responsibility for clearly conveying what food item you have made through the ability to modify it's description and name should be on the player, not on the code. If you start naming all your hot dogs 'nazi cocks' which simply read 'smells like facism' when you look at them, then you are abusing the feature and that is an issue that needs to be handled by the staff team and an ahelp. Used properly, this feature does not need a little tag telling you that, say, the chili dogs you put out on the counter are in fact hot dogs, when it is within your power to explain that it is a hot dog with chili on top via the mechanics now available. Additionally, there are a number of food items in the game whose name is either exotic, memey, or otherise not helpful for describing what they are (without metagame) for the general public, like 'Bibimbap', 'Roffle Waffles', 'Soylent Green/Viridian' 'Spacy Liberty Duff' 'Spesslaw', and 'Borscht'. Being told you recognize this plate of 'Beef Stroganoff" as 'Spesslaw' does not particularly assist the player in comprehension of what they are eating more than a good description would. The feature is not intended to be used to deceive or troll people, we don't need a feature to protect us from it when it's being used properly, that's why we have administrative oversight.

>Engaging combat system My sides. This is literally the most unpleasant and unfulfilling combat system I've ever had in a video game. It's terrible. The only thing I could say I like about this is I'll have to expend less effort in knocking someone down now because I can ram into them instead of frantically trying to click on them. And that makes my life marginally easier when I am forced to use this awful combat system.

I'm sorry, but panicking sounds like a problem with the players. If there is a psychotic AI trying to kill everyone or a death cult kidnapping people, then the crew at large should damn well know the problems that threaten their lives. Trying to block out the crew at large just in case someone panics and acts like an idiot is the wrong way to do this.

Guys, what the heck are you talking about. We don't use top down, the vending machines are basically viewed directly from the front. And characters in the game are always viewed at eye level, despite making it look like they're parallel to the floor half the time. This is a sprite based game with inconsistent vision angles between objects and scenery, so it's a bit rich to complain that the perspective of these vending machines (who already can be viewed from almost the same angle as the current vending machines) is 'distracting'. I think they're fine, largely speaking, as vending machines, though some of them aren't too different from the in-game ones, like that Tool dispenser.