Security Uniform Tweaks Again

[wowzewow]

https://github.com/Aurorastation/Aurora.3/pull/14229

Please let me know what you think.

Edited June 7, 2022 by wowzewow

[DriedMilk]

since i spike to you about it on the discord-

can you make sure the rolled sleeve version of the uniform dont clip (around arms and neck)  with the loadout short sleeve shirts so that officers can wear stuff over them 

[stev]

EDIT: Yeah, y'know what, this post was pretty kneejerky and unproductive. I still think changing PMCG's palette yet again should be accompanied with additions/tweaks to loadout items so that the palette fits together, but I posted this pretty late and is overall a little incomprehensible. Will post more thought-through feedback soon.

Spoiler

While I get that some people don't like the PMCG grey, the changes to the PMCG items/palette are highly inconsistent and strange. You've made EPMC and PMCG now both have black as their main colour, making it difficult to distinguish between them, and the "tweaked" PMCG hats are neither new EPMC black, new PMCG black, or the current iteration of PMCG grey-blue, instead seemingly reverting the palette all the way back to the Horizon launch PMCG colours. This is both internally inconsistent within Security and inconsistent with all other PMCG items--PMCG medical uniforms seem to be untouched, as are the PMCG armband and modsuit. Why are we switching PMCG hats to a colour that is used solely by EPMC and Zavodskoi? 

Also, this adds a load of Zavod alt items all pathed as 'necro', which is again quite old deprecated lore.

Edited June 7, 2022 by stev
spoilered my indecipherable late-night rambling. don't post in bed, kids

[wowzewow]

3 hours ago, stev said:

You've made EPMC and PMCG now both have black as their main colour, making it difficult to distinguish between them

I don't really understand how this is a problem. The grey is a definite bad choice as it blends with the floor tiles. Anyway, it is with my full intention that they match the old uniforms as much as possible as they are tried-and-tested already, and people are familiar with them. If there is a lore issue that EPMC and PCMG *HAS* to be different then I will change it.

3 hours ago, stev said:

the "tweaked" PMCG hats are neither new EPMC black, new PMCG black, or the current iteration of PMCG grey-blue, instead seemingly reverting the palette all the way back to the Horizon launch PMCG colours

3 hours ago, stev said:

Why are we switching PMCG hats to a colour that is used solely by EPMC and Zavodskoi? 

I've made them have the same kind of greyish-black used by the belts so players have an option to have a grey PMCG hat while being able to complement the new PCMG outfits. The greys and blacks aren't exclusive colors. They're shared by all corporations. Zavodskoi also has an additional cap selection so players can have more choices.

3 hours ago, stev said:

This is both internally inconsistent within Security and inconsistent with all other PMCG items--PMCG medical uniforms seem to be untouched, as are the PMCG armband and modsuit. Why are we switching PMCG hats to a colour that is used solely by EPMC and Zavodskoi? 

This is a security uniform PR.

3 hours ago, stev said:

Also, this adds a load of Zavod alt items all pathed as 'necro', which is again quite old deprecated lore.

This isn't player facing. What is the problem here?

Stev, I appreciate your feedback, but I don't really understand what you want me to do. It would be much more helpful to me if you included some suggestions on how to fix your problems. I.e, "You could fix the inconsistency here by doing X and Y" or something like that. Thanks

 

Edited June 7, 2022 by wowzewow

[wowzewow]

4 hours ago, DriedMilk said:

since i spike to you about it on the discord-

can you make sure the rolled sleeve version of the uniform dont clip (around arms and neck)  with the loadout short sleeve shirts so that officers can wear stuff over them 

I think it's just because the loadout short sleeve shirts are old as hell. I'll fix them in a seperate PR

[niennab]

I like that there's more use of darker colours across the board. Although personally I'd advise against using pillow shading. With it, the uniforms have a more rounded shape to the body as well an unclear light source. Zav_old is a good example of utilizing shadows to it's advantage with a more clearly defined light source. Maybe a blend of your palette along with the old shadows would suit the uniforms better. Especailly cpnsidering the old uniforms have nearly imperceptible shadows.

Additionally, I think what was supposed to be breast pockets on the original uniform look more akin to folds if a character has breasts when zoomed out on the revised versions. I don't know if this is just me seeing that though.

Here's a good example of what pillow shading is:

Spoiler

 

Edited June 7, 2022 by niennab

[wowzewow]

1 hour ago, niennab said:

I like that there's more use of darker colours across the board. Although personally I'd advise against using pillow shading. With it, the uniforms have a more rounded shape to the body as well an unclear light source. Zav_old is a good example of utilizing shadows to it's advantage with a more clearly defined light source. Maybe a blend of your palette along with the old shadows would suit the uniforms better. Especailly cpnsidering the old uniforms have nearly imperceptible shadows.

Additionally, I think what was supposed to be breast pockets on the original uniform look more akin to folds if a character has breasts when zoomed out on the revised versions. I don't know if this is just me seeing that though.

Here's a good example of what pillow shading is:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Fair point. However, I'd like to make sure all the uniforms are at a satisfactory level first before I make large, sweeping changes to the shading. Thanks.

[MattAtlas]

I actually really, really like the new PMCG uniform with this PR. Very sleek.

I think the EPMC security officer's uniform (the white shirt/black pants one) is good, but the amount of buttons is a little odd. It should look like a shirt/polo if anything, so with 2-3 buttons at the top instead of all the way down.

The alt one looks menacing as fuck. I'm a fan of it.

Bonus picture with armor:

The Idris alt uniform looks alright, even if a bit niche. It doesn't reeeeaaaaaaally fit the Idris theme of being a sleek banker corporation, this uniform looks a bit detached from that. I think it can be kept in so that people can choose to be particularly LARP as Idris, though.

The normal Idris uniform has the same issue as the EPMC uniform. The buttons going all the way down are weird.

The Zavodskoi uniforms look alright. This one's the only one I'm unsure of:

The black/brown combination may be a bit odd at first, but I think the contrast is growing on me. Other than that, it has the same button spam issue as the other uniforms mentioned above Looks extra good with armor, though :

Zavod alt looks good, too. No real complaints about it.

Bonus armor pic:

All the side sprites look good.

 

[MattAtlas]

Warden uniforms are a bit trickier. Here's the PMCG one:

Armor on:

I think this one looks fine.

Here's the Idris one:

The shirt's green here is way, way too overbearing. You need to find a different color or shirt style.

Here's the Zavod one:

Don't really have any issue with it. Looks fine.

[Zelmana]

Wezzy these are looking better. Thanks for responding to criticism.

I would still appreciate that the suits for the investigator be reverted to their originals.
As a sidenote, both "Executive Suit" and "Black Suit" in loadouts are the same.

[stev]

3 hours ago, MattAtlas said:

Warden uniforms are a bit trickier. Here's the PMCG one:

Armor on:

I think this one looks fine.

Here's the Idris one:

The shirt's green here is way, way too overbearing. You need to find a different color or shirt style.

Here's the Zavod one:

Don't really have any issue with it. Looks fine.

I think a recurring issue with this new Warden sprite pattern is it's just sorta like, too plain? It feels like we've been moving backwards from the initial NBT Warden jumpsuits with the cool highlights and shoulder bits, then down to basic Officer shirt + tie + pants uniforms with the Officer/Warden switch, and now to just pants and a coloured shirt. The Zavod and PMCG Warden uniforms here seem quite indistinct from the other uniforms, though that might just be because the 'new' PMCG one has just been swapped with the old PMCG Investigator from the previous PR. I like the little yellow-gold breast pocket highlight on the Idris one, though, is there any chance we could get similar highlights on the other Warden uniforms to distinguish them a bit more?

As for the PMCG Sec switch to black from grey, I don't really oppose it after thinking about it a bit more. I would request that we get alt PMCG Sec uniforms with the PMCG Med/blue-grey colouration, though, as the lighter colour is quite nice for some loadouts and helps keep the overall PMCG palette a bit more consistent.

EDIT: The new dark-grey PMCG hats and black EPMC hats should probably also be alt versions in loadout, as they're for both Medical and Security PMCG but Medical seems to be staying light-grey.

Edited June 7, 2022 by stev

[stev]

Also, if the Warden uniform is going to get breast pocket highlights, those highlights should probably be removed from the Investigator uniforms (as the new Warden sprites are mostly just swaps with the Investigator sprites). If you can't spot them on the Investigator uniforms, that's cos they've been recoloured to just be the same colour as the trousers of whatever corp they are, so they don't really do much as highlights on those uniforms.

EDIT: The new Zavod & PMCG Investigator/Warden uniforms for reference:

Edited June 7, 2022 by stev

[NewOriginalSchwann]

Aside from the Idris warden uniform, which is way too green, I like them! These are a big improvement, and it's nice to see Zavodskoi's black uniform being black rather than a kind of washed-out grey-blue color.

[Confused rock]

from loadout, looks like black zavod caps/berets are options but they appear as invisible.