Complaint on Unknown Murder

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

BYOND Key: Senpai Jackboot

Game ID: bo47Xf

Player Byond Key: UnknownMurder

Staff involved: (This is if the complaint was ahelped and if it was handled by a staff member)

Reason for complaint: Poor Captain play.

Heisters came with the following demands:

-Robotics Lab Dismantled

-Detective MRLO-5512 Cuffed and prepared with EVA Gear at intruder's choice of location

-Security confined to habitable areas of the Security.

-Disable Hull Shields

Vincent LeChiffre, the Captain, immediately complied. He demanded that security be locked inside the brig, knowing that the brig was vented and not all of our officers had internals. I, Head of Security Triaka, expressed this then told only the two tajara officers who had voidsuits to remain in the brig. Then the Captain started getting snippy, so I ordered both Tajara to 'the north hallway' in order to not give the enemy heisters full knowledge of where half my staff were, for their safety.

The Captain also ordered my unathi officer out of the bridge meeting room during a meeting. I agreed but insisted the unathi remain outside the meeting room for our safety. The Captain refused, began undermining my authority, issuing direct orders and accusing me of having a failed implant. Then, during negotiations with the intruders, he kicked me out of the meeting room and refused to speak with me or security.

The unathi officer and I responded to reports of bad activity in RnD maintenence, and ended up in a firefight with the heisters. We did ok, but we were outnumbered and were unable to retreat due to someone bolting the doors shut. AFter our deaths, the Captain immediately blamed us, called security incompetent, made announcements about how incompetent we were, and assured the heisters he was complying with all the demands.

My complaint is that the Captain was the most smug, condescending character I have ever encountered. Every single word out of his mouth was a patronizing comment or an order that undermined Triaka. He spent the entire shift, once antags showed up, taking direct control of the security department and disregarding every single thing his head of security said, insulting the head of security on the security channel and issuing contradictory orders that sowed so much confusion that command authority broke down entirely, which is probably why security ended up scattered and picked off.

A Captain should not act with assumed absolute authority and take direct control of a department that has an active head of staff, nor undermine it. It was pointed out IC'ly that Triaka is better qualified to handle these situations, being the HoS, and he just dismissed her. It seems like he was planning the entire time to dismiss sec and aggressively hold hands with the antags to enable them.

This behavior is not fit for a captain's role. A Captain should not value his HoS so little that he not only fucks with their authority and department, orders them locked inside breached departments, but also insults them even after death. He made station announcements about security incompetence, blaming us for our deaths, after the other unathi and I lost the firefight in RnD maintenance during a scouting run, where we were ambushed.

Following our death was that it was because of security's incompetence that he was now forced to comply with the antags; that he had exhausted all other options. This was a huge lie and a slap to face to me, because he had given my character crap over him immediately accepting their terms, kicking me out of a negotiation between all of command and the heisters when I had brought up that I was willing to comply with only some of their demands, not giving up crew or locking people in breached departments.

Even when a member of security was being tortured by the antagonists he was dismissive and patronizing, to the point that even the heisters pointed it out.

The smug attitude from the Captain was unbelievable; the antagonists and our inevitable deaths were all fine and I enjoyed it, and all of my frustration is honed entirely on his behavior. I don't think he is fit to be in the captain role, and I know others in deadchat and on discord involved voiced similar concerns. I'll direct them here.

Did you attempt to adminhelp the issue at the time? If so, what was the known action taken by administration/moderation?

Alberyk told me to make a complaint.

Approximate Date/Time: 6:40 11/7/2016

[ForgottenTraveller]

I was the CE (Moore) of this round and in the meeting room when some of this was taking place. While I cannot speak of the prior issues. In the meeting room. Both the officer and the HoS refused to follow any suggestion or stated order given by the captain, and came off as fully insubordinate, and damn near seditious at times. Moments after being released, the HoS and two officers were dead. Despite the orders they were given. At no time did the captain call them incompetent publicly, The notice did not call them incompetent. It said 'due to them not following orders'

And as a reminder, the newish CCIA announcement. Given the common cases of command staff, security in particular ignoring captain's orders.

This is a general reminder that your station's assigned captain has full authority over the operation of your station. This means they are allowed to shut down areas and departments at their discretion, re-assign crewmembers, issue orders to all crewmembers on the station that are expected to be obeyed, and even take actions that may skirt the line of regulation in non-standard situations. Remember that your captain is loyalty implanted, and therefore is trusted to act in the best interest of the company, crew, and station he is assigned to. Any complaints or concerns over the captain's decisions should be addressed after whatever situation prompted these decisions has been resolved.

[UnknownMurder]

Vincent LeChiffre, the Captain, immediately complied. He demanded that security be locked inside the brig, knowing that the brig was vented and not all of our officers had internals. I, Head of Security Triaka, expressed this then told only the two tajara officers who had voidsuits to remain in the brig. Then the Captain started getting snippy, so I ordered both Tajara to 'the north hallway' in order to not give the enemy heisters full knowledge of where half my staff were, for their safety.

 

That was were I wanted the Security to be. Somewhere near the Security Brig.

 

The Captain also ordered my unathi officer out of the bridge meeting room during a meeting. I agreed but insisted the unathi remain outside the meeting room for our safety. The Captain refused, began undermining my authority, issuing direct orders and accusing me of having a failed implant. Then, during negotiations with the intruders, he kicked me out of the meeting room and refused to speak with me or security.

And you continued to refuse to follow orders. I did not refuse to speak with you. You didn't contact me over headset command channel or PDA. You wanted to fight them. I wanted to resolve peacefully. You refused my orders. I dismissed you. You could have lost your job right away if this was real life.

 

The unathi officer and I responded to reports of bad activity in RnD maintenence, and ended up in a firefight with the heisters. We did ok, but we were outnumbered and were unable to retreat due to someone bolting the doors shut. AFter our deaths, the Captain immediately blamed us, called security incompetent, made announcements about how incompetent we were, and assured the heisters he was complying with all the demands.

That wasn't my orders to tell you to go to the R&D. You went there on your choice. Why did you go and fight I don't know 3-4 people without calling backup? I'm supposing the backup came and late, got tortured, refused to scream for his life, and died when Amalia demanded me to order the backup to scream for his life. He still refused.

 

A Captain should not act with assumed absolute authority and take direct control of a department that has an active head of staff, nor undermine it. It was pointed out IC'ly that Triaka is better qualified to handle these situations, being the HoS, and he just dismissed her. It seems like he was planning the entire time to dismiss sec and aggressively hold hands with the antags to enable them.

See CCIA announcement. You continued to question my order in the conference room and bicker with me.

 

Even when a member of security was being tortured by the antagonists he was dismissive and patronizing, to the point that even the heisters pointed it out.

Wrong. Alamia ordered me to order the Security to scream for his life for his safety. He didn't scream. He got dismembered. We saw the Security Camera through RAT's cameras.

I had adminhelped to Alberyk after your deaths, Alberyk acted as if I was proceeding in the right way.

I believe this is a case of you got yourself killed because you didn't listen to the Captain. I am not sure what you want me to say. I am unsure how you believe I am acting smug. Head of Personnel, Chief Engineer and I were discussing how we should tackle the obstacle. We even thought about setting a trap or something relevant until that point the Security blamed the Captain (me) for your deaths and closing the door on you and soon almost turned the station against me and got the station to rile up against me and settled down for a moment. I don't know what you want me to say here. What do you want me to say? What do you want me to clarify things for you? What do you want me to explain for you? I valued the lives of the crew members more than I valued my own life. Not to mention, I dragged two people to the escape pod at the end of the shuttle without attempting to engage in fights. On other hand, you want to risk lives. Oh. And you baited me in ICing in OOC over the discord where Alberyk had to step in and tell you to stop while I retracted my post.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

I did not order my staff to take hostile action against the heisters. I was ordering them to stay out of contact with them and gear up as best they could.

And you specifically gave me a mission to recover the disk, until I abandoned it for being unfeasable with how unarmed we were.

Triaka's priorities were the safety of crew members and the safety of command members. Security, before Triak had to figure out how to obey you without risking them all getting murdered by teleporting heisters who know where they are, was trying to get weapons and collect themselves, but your captain was acting like a silly billy.

When the brig was being breached and security was in a rush to gear up your captain ordered Triaka to stop putting on a voidsuit to come talk to him, and got offended when she asked for him to wait for her to get on a voidsuit and internals, making her stop and walk all the way over just to have him whisper that the disk is missing and hand her the pinpointer while telling her to retrieve it... when sec had nothing but tasers

She was not trying to be seditious. You had put the entire command staff of the station in a single room and you bolted the door out, when the enemy was known to be able to cloak and teleport almost anywhere. It was unbelievably risky to order the officer out of the room, but I complied. The argument was whether or not he could stand on the other side of the door, which was shut and where he could not listen in on the secrets but enter if anyone teleported in and started gunning down command. You instead demanded the officer go all the way to the breached brig, putting himself and all of command in danger.

And we did call for back-up. We fell into an ambush. The officers did not arrive in time because they did what you told them to do.

And I know Captain's have authority over security. That does not mean they should undermine their HoS. The HoS is appointed for a reason and it's implied that they know enough about security situations to have them be listened to. There was no bending on anything - you just gave an order and refused to listen to any reason. You took attempting to communicate why it would be bad idea as insubordination, and it spilled into the meeting room where it made both of us look bad. You kept pulling power plays while Triaka was trying to explain why your methods were causing severe stress to the security team.

I might as well have entered cryo the moment the heisters arrived, the way you assumed direct control.

You are saying you valued their lives more than yours, but your character didn't. You put security officers into harms way repeatedly, callously, and without hesitation or consideration of anything the HoS or officers said to object.

I want you to admit that your Captain's smug attitude and inability to delegate or accept criticism or compromise makes him a poor Captain.

[Ron]

I was involved as a heister so I saw most of what went down

I want you to admit that your Captain's smug attitude and inability to delegate or accept criticism or compromise makes him a poor Captain.

yes so my ego will be okay. What a less than smart request to make on a complaint lol... really shows what you are trying to get out of this

Anyways, I think the captain could have been more laid back, though it was your fault you died, Jackboot.

"The unathi officer and I responded to reports of bad activity in RnD maintenence, and ended up in a firefight with the heisters. "

we were leaving to negotiate and if you would have listened and stayed in security you wouldn't have died... which is what the captain was trying to prevent... but you did it anyways.... and died.... So yeah, I mean nothing really wrong here besides him insulting you but even that can be considered an IC thing.

"I did not order my staff to take hostile action against the heisters. I was ordering them to stay out of contact with them and gear up as best they could"

didn't you just say you were going to go respond to reports of bad activity? And then you fought the heisters?

"And we did call for back-up. We fell into an ambush. The officers did not arrive in time because they did what you told them to do."

which is a good thing because they would have died as well, also it wasn't an ambush, you legit walked into us as we were leaving to talk terms with you guys

"The HoS is appointed for a reason and it's implied that they know enough about security situations to have them be listened to. "

if the HoS is doing things that will lead to security dying (See above) then yeah, the captain should take away some of that power

" You instead demanded the officer go all the way to the breached brig, putting himself and all of command in danger."

yes because we would have slaughtered you if he didn't, it was one of our main demands, the captain was in the right with that

" I had brought up that I was willing to comply with only some of their demands, not giving up crew or locking people in breached departments."

again, you not complying to the demands led to you to get killed, not the captain

Anyways, the captain was in the right here. He was giving orders to protect and serve the station, and you broke them, left security and DIED. Which is what the Captain knew would happen, and tried to prevent.

also, don't ignore what ForgottenTravel said because that is important as well

[veradox]

hey there i was cadmus that round and after the captain drafted me while i was talking about how to blow up the AI core with the HoP I just about never left the captain's side.

let's go down the list of events that transpired that i was able to witness from this perspective.

1. we hear someone breaking into a nearby room and beeline for the captain's office. the disk is gone. we immediately inform the HoS.

2. captain tries to investigate short-term as he has the pinpointer and we actively attempt to keep the HoS informed on the situation and our movement patterns but all in all we never see her arrive.

3. we relocate the nuclear device to the AI core by the captain's orders, we being the HoP, Captain and I

4. armory gets raided apparently in the meantime as the code is raised, but security doesn't seem to be all that underarmed with the ptr and some energy gear + shields. i've just been remoduled at this point by request. looked like they were trotting towards departures, either by request or by some sort of patrol i'm unaware of and didn't much care for.

5. captain is busy attempting to acquire the terrorist's demands at this point. i show up and they organize a 'private' channel line which of course a tajaran sneaks into

6. demands are somewhat identified and the captain hails a group meeting of command staff

7. the captain orders security to relocate to a hospitable location in the brig, and the ligger HoS walks in. she is accompanied by one of her lizard goon friends. we waste valuable time attempting to get the HoS to obey the chain of command despite loyalty implantation and relocate the officer from site, but some random force appeared to prevent them from taking orders and they resumed to be insubordinate for the rest of the shift that they remained alive for.

8. i was ordered to attempt to extricate the unathi from the brig. unathi being unathi, they either geared up in voidsuits or the breacher at the first sign of trouble, and it was very difficult to reason with either of these individuals as they spoke in their hiss hiss tongue over communications to avoid further scrutiny for their insubordination over the security channel. they're overtly aggressive over the communications line and continue to fail to adhere to the captain's orders, even when the situation was mildly well contained in terms of collateral.

9. eventually i explained the situation of hyper aggression from the lizard cronie non-command staff to the Captain and just bolted the door to the bridge and left the hop door unbolted.

10. the HoS is told to fuck off by the negotiators via the private channel. somewhere around this time there were laser shots which indicated the AI had just been slain by a rogue secbot, but we were all unaware of this occurring because it was a gank on an AFK.

11. we continue negotiations while the standing order for the security team to remain within the brig goes into effect as part of the hostage demands.

12. clearly this was not followed, the lizards get themselves caught in a sticky situation and hail additional security members into a futile effort of reprise and we lose 3 officers in a span of a couple seconds, effectively crippling the security team and resulting in the terrorists getting even more leverage than the now generally useless disc.

13. captain informs the crew of how our ability to now deal with the terrorists has been effectively crippled because security couldn't wait long enough to get their valids for a proper plan to be devised in which we could eliminate all the hostiles while posing minimal risk.

14. we eventually just had to submit because of the actions of security. we hailed up MRLO, part of the terrorist's demands, and asked him if he would submit himself to the terrorists in cuffs. he complied, we were ready to keep the rest of the station in check and attempted to appeal to the terrorists.

15. they were silent for a long time, and we never did end up doing the trade-off for a hostage. sometime around here the lizard cronie to the HoS was put on comms and ordered to scream so as to prevent himself from being killed by the terrorists (they were edgy af) and again denied his order, and was eventually killed instead of doing the simple act that would preserve his life. o well.

16. bears attack, after that fiasco is over i check out the cameras and we end up confirming three KIA, the loss of all of our robotics and R&D equipment except for a circuit imprinter (necessary demands from the terrorists), we find out the AI is dead after a camera breaks, and that the other two station bound synthetics were subverted.

17. the trade never goes off and we prep for an effort to evacuate seeing as our near complete asset loss was so crippling there was no point in scaring the heisters off with an ERT (they made no explicit anti-NT demands or personality identifiers, only that they were anti-synthetics) and losing all the bodies and evacc'd, as we had not the force to attend to them if they got aggressive; an immediate deliverance of the situation on arrival to central would suffice in the way of attempting to recover our lost. this was not the captain's suggestion, it was my own suggestion in an effort to minimize additional altercations. there appeared to be generally no dispute over this among the available command staff and two IPCs in the bridge, so we left.

now let's dip into some even more spicy memes.

1. the captain was never undefended at any point in time either by structural fortifications of the bridge or by myself being an appointed bodyguard. the hos was informed that he was never undefended.

2. there was absolutely no indication or word of a teleporting intruder, only the allegation that they were capable of cloaking and that they had hacked into many doors.

3. the HoS and his lizard officer clearly preferred their own route of performance rather than heeding the Captain, the highest authority on the station at that time, to conduct negotiations and organize a successful act against the terrorists. this plan of action would usually be called taking it slow, but instead it was a violent charge.

4. the captain preferred everyone and their lives to remain intact. there was not a lull in this. he informed security to remain out of the way to avoid loss of life, ordered civillians to evacuate to the bridge for safety after our loss of assets deemed only a plausible situation for evacuation, and then designated for an attempt to rescue an ipc virologist under duress by the emagged security bot while standing by from the forefront of the attack (preventing his own loss of life) which was eventually made null by Melchor's remote detonating of the unit (bless).

there may be some off-time scheduling with the terrorist responsiveness, but this is the gist of what happened and the amount of severity from which extended of security's actions. you'd think a loyalty implant could do a little bit more than what happened here but whatever. if i can follow standing orders from the HoS in babyrage then i'm sure they can instruct their personnel and itself to adhere to the captain's orders.

[Jennalele]

Hi, Thasethel here. I was the officer that was on the bridge party. From my perspective, what I saw was the Captain undermining and repeatedly disregarding the authority of the Commander, and never giving explanation or reasoning behind his demands. She made a valid request that at least one officer stay behind and watch the bridge for them in the meeting- It was downright stupid to gather ALL of command staff into one small room without at least an eye out. I'd also like to note that the Captain WAS incredibly rude, and seemed to be offended and insulted that the Commander wanted to first gear into EVA before attending to his orders, given the situation.

Within about five minutes, I hear laser fire from the AI core- Not the kind from the turrets that's a bunch going off at once, but brief, rapid burst. I'd figured that someone was in the core, and called it. At this point, the Commander is evidently kicked out of the meeting, and we go to see what happened at the core. But instead, we're called to another disturbance in Research Maintenance. Because the rest of security was ordered into the brig, which was largely depressurized, we had no backup. I had a laser rifle and a riot shield, and came in just ahead of the Commander.

We were ambushed by the entire heist team, AND a rogue cyborg that locked us in. There was a brief, intense firefight, but the heist team used a phoron canister to cheese their way through the fight, as nobody wanted to hit the canister and explode everything ever. We call for backup repeatedly, but because the Captain had overridden the Commander's orders, security was a mess, and couldn't get down to us in time. Despite putting up a good fight, we go down, and are captured. The Commander dies on arrival, and Thas gets stuck for an hour or so there.

It's at this point I hear the Captain make several EXTREMELY disrespectful announcements on the comms, blaming the deaths on the Commander's incompetence and insubordination. I felt it was INCREDIBLY immature and disrespectful, and unfitting of a captain, not to mention, uncalled for in a situation like that. He had just lost several crew members, it was not the time to be pointing fingers and saying "welp, commander was a retard, gg." It was handled very hamfistedly and disrespectfully. At some point, one of the heisters declares that they're trying to torture Thas. The Captain, maybe through the chaos, didn't get the right memo, and ordered the wrong crewmember. When corrected that it was Thasethel under their captivity, the Captain didn't seem to react further, or correct himself. In fact, I don't recall any reply after that.

What happened after that I'm uncertain of, as the heister accidentally cut off one of my hands, letting me free enough to attack her back. They panicked and killed me, so I was out of the round at that point.

The point I'm trying to make is: The Captain should be able to trust their commander to lead their own damn department, and not override direct control from the start. He's expected to COMMUNICATE with his other heads of staff, and reach an agreement between them. At no time did I see this- He just went straight for the "assuming direct control" route, which was incredibly disrespectful and ultimately led to Security dissolving into chaos and death.

EDIT: I'd also like to add that the heisters shot first. If they had just calmed the fuck down and explained to us, we wouldn't have shot back. But no. Despite going to do 'peaceful negotiations,' you saw us and tried to annhilate us on sight. We weren't going to attack unless you did. Which you did.

[Ron]

"He just went straight for the "assuming direct control" route, which was incredibly disrespectful and ultimately led to Security dissolving into chaos and death."

no, the HoS did that when he decided to go into the maint and disobey orders. That is YOUR and HIS fault. Not the captains.

"It's at this point I hear the Captain make several EXTREMELY disrespectful announcements on the comms, blaming the deaths on the Commander's incompetence and insubordination. "

I would be pissed too if my HoS decided to disobey orders and go into maint and get killed

[veradox]

Hi, Thasethel here. I was the officer that was on the bridge party. From my perspective, what I saw was the Captain undermining and repeatedly disregarding the authority of the Commander, and never giving explanation or reasoning behind his demands. She made a valid request that at least one officer stay behind and watch the bridge for them in the meeting- It was downright stupid to gather ALL of command staff into one small room without at least an eye out. I'd also like to note that the Captain WAS incredibly rude, and seemed to be offended and insulted that the Commander wanted to first gear into EVA before attending to his orders, given the situation.

Within about five minutes, I hear laser fire from the AI core- Not the kind from the turrets that's a bunch going off at once, but brief, rapid burst. I'd figured that someone was in the core, and called it. At this point, the Commander is evidently kicked out of the meeting, and we go to see what happened at the core. But instead, we're called to another disturbance in Research Maintenance. Because the rest of security was ordered into the brig, which was largely depressurized, we had no backup. I had a laser rifle and a riot shield, and came in just ahead of the Commander.

We were ambushed by the entire heist team, AND a rogue cyborg that locked us in. There was a brief, intense firefight, but the heist team used a phoron canister to cheese their way through the fight, as nobody wanted to hit the canister and explode everything ever. We call for backup repeatedly, but because the Captain had overridden the Commander's orders, security was a mess, and couldn't get down to us in time. Despite putting up a good fight, we go down, and are captured. The Commander dies on arrival, and Thas gets stuck for an hour or so there.

It's at this point I hear the Captain make several EXTREMELY disrespectful announcements on the comms, blaming the deaths on the Commander's incompetence and insubordination. I felt it was INCREDIBLY immature and disrespectful, and unfitting of a captain, not to mention, uncalled for in a situation like that. He had just lost several crew members, it was not the time to be pointing fingers and saying "welp, commander was a retard, gg." It was handled very hamfistedly and disrespectfully. At some point, one of the heisters declares that they're trying to torture Thas. The Captain, maybe through the chaos, didn't get the right memo, and ordered the wrong crewmember. When corrected that it was Thasethel under their captivity, the Captain didn't seem to react further, or correct himself. In fact, I don't recall any reply after that.

What happened after that I'm uncertain of, as the heister accidentally cut off one of my hands, letting me free enough to attack her back. They panicked and killed me, so I was out of the round at that point.

The point I'm trying to make is: The Captain should be able to trust their commander to lead their own damn department, and not override direct control from the start. He's expected to COMMUNICATE with his other heads of staff, and reach an agreement between them. At no time did I see this- He just went straight for the "assuming direct control" route, which was incredibly disrespectful and ultimately led to Security dissolving into chaos and death.

EDIT: I'd also like to add that the heisters shot first. If they had just calmed the fuck down and explained to us, we wouldn't have shot back. But no. Despite going to do 'peaceful negotiations,' you saw us and tried to annhilate us on sight. We weren't going to attack unless you did. Which you did.

 

i will politely explain what was wrong with this post with inclusion of information from my prior one which filled most if not all of the gaps as well as some minor details.

---

---

1. the Captain is the leading executive authority on the station. the head of security, regardless of whether or not it was their department, is bound to adhere to the Captain's authority.

2. the Captain was less than rude, and simply ordered privacy in a situation where not only was the HoS armed with a voidsuit piercing tranquilizer gun and breacher module, but the Captain had both myself and his energy pistol. his attempts at making sure that the heisters didn't attack us prematurely because of an insubordinate officer (Thasethel) refusing to listen to orders on what appeared to be a matter of species relation(??????????!?)[see: deliberately using unathi speech in security channel to communicate unrest to the HoS; ganging up upon synthetic unit Cadmus who attempted to explain the futility of denying executive orders by order; not informing over the security channel the hearing of the laser fire, only speaking to each other] and general unknowing/disrespect of the chain of command

3. the Head of Security was not kicked out over any petty matters, she was removed because she decided she wanted to interject and was firmly rebuked by the terrorists, and if her opinion was not going to be weighted by the terrorists, she simply shouldn't be wasting her time not keeping security awake.

4. the Captain was not 'childish' in his announcements, his announcements provided insight to the crewmembers in that we had lost our security department due to x reasons, which was in fact insubordination. whether or not it was a split second decision doesn't change the fact a standing order was denied numerous times over the course of five minutes. if we are in a completely crippled situation then the crew were to deserve the reasoning as to why we, the crew, are incapable of resisting anymore. if i'm able to listen to orders then a trained security professional should be able to as well.

5. whether the order failed to directly reach or not, officer Thasethel was identified in the long run and the order and requirement for you to scream to protect your own life was given whether the context was the wrong person or not. you yourself were even aware of this situation as you provided a firm denial to scream over communications before Thasethel's inevitable death. there would be very few people actively being threatened with being dismembered if only one officer was claimed to be still alive. clearly whether or not the Captain directly informed Thasethel of this order or not, Thasethel would not comply and instead chose to blindly charge the terrorists when they had the free moment while, needless to say, being handicapped

6. the Captain was well in-tuned with the act of communication, having hailed numerous command staff meetings to assist in negotiations and determining the course of action, and having me page the HoS with situation reports when necessary. in addendum to this, he even provided faxed situation reports from which to assist decisionmaking. had there not been an extreme amount of disorder in the operations of the security department, with enough time, everyone would have likely survived. but oh well

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

Before he called me cancer, Veradox's events give a wrong chain of events. The problems with the Captain extended long before the issue in maintenence, including his assuming direct control of security, which happened the moment heisters gave their demands. We did not attempt to valid the heisters, hence the fact (at least I) actively avoided them and didn't confront them until we did our investigation into RnD maintenance. There was a lull of several minutes between the meeting and the ambush in maintenance.

Your narrative of a valid hungry security falls apart in the face of Triaka's actual standing orders, which were consistently non-confrontational and entirely reactionary. This is especially true given the fact the captain gave Triaka an order to attack the heisters to recover the disk, which Triaka actually abandoned in favor of keeping sec hovering in the central hall to respond to any emerging threats.

Given that you're going to behave in an immature fashion in this complaint and call me cancer and lie in your responses, this is the only response I'm going to give your posts, and focus on UM and any other involved parties.

To get back on topic; I've played Triaka quite a bit, including in rounds where the station gets attacked by aggressive antags. She doesn't always win the situation, but in nearly every case her department functions at the basic level as her officers generally listen to her. This round was bewildering because of how utterly trashed the entire notion of command and delegation was. I had a difficult time figuring out how to even respond to the Captain's bewildering behavior as Triaka because it was so bizarre and demeaning, and there were no effective means of solving the issues without further undermining Command authority by getting CC involved, especially when it was a high stakes situation.

If the Captain went into engineering, insulted the Chief Engineer, and took direct control of engineering during this heist and ordered all engineers to remodel the bar, that would be in essence what this was like.

Or if he had assumed direct control of medical, argued with the CMO on medical comms about his qualifications, and demanded all medical staff drop what they're doing and hide on the solars.

There would have been no issues if the Captain had issued orders on the command channel for Triaka to interpret (such as "do not attack the heisters while we negotiate", which was all she needed) for her to issue to her officers, which would have shown the most bare bones sense of respect for Captain responsibilities.

[UnknownMurder]

There would have been no issues if the Captain had issued orders on the command channel for Triaka to interpret (such as "do not attack the heisters while we negotiate", which was all she needed) for her to issue to her officers, which would have shown the most bare bones sense of respect for Captain responsibilities.

 

That's what we did, we told you not to attack them and move yourselves to Security. I canceled the order for the Nuclear Disk, I told you to get to Security. I told the Security Officer in the Bridge to get to Security. This was my only order standing. Get to Security. How did you end up being in Research and Development?

 

If the Captain went into engineering, insulted the Chief Engineer, and took direct control of engineering during this heist and ordered all engineers to remodel the bar, that would be in essence what this was like.

Or if he had assumed direct control of medical, argued with the CMO on medical comms about his qualifications, and demanded all medical staff drop what they're doing and hide on the solars.

 

Irrelevant example for the case.

You lied in some of your parts in your OP post too and acted immature in-game. It was pointed out by ForgottenTraveler and Veradox. Jackboot. Kettle calling pot black.

I'm going to have to point this out again. Are you aware of this CCIA announcement? If you're not, this the exact same case that's been happening with Command Staffs attempting to refuse Captain's orders.

 

I call upon a Counter-Complaint to put Jackboot's roleplay under review and request logs of the entire incident including announcements.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

This is what i was talking about. You refuse to admit any form of fault or that you had any part in why there was so much tension.

I had a discussion with Serveris about when it's suitable to disobey the Captain as a Head of Security. It was explained that the HoS is the tactical authority, not the Captain, just as the CMO is the medical authority, not the Captain. If the decision by the Captain is seen as able to cause serious harm, or seriously hamper security operations or security in general, then it can be disobeyed.

The incident in the meeting room can go to you. I was trying to strongly advise that the officer remain because of how dangerous it was to stuff all command in the room with teleporting heisters. I was trying to argue to keep them in the bridge outside the door, for our safety, but you immediately jumped to accusing Triaka of having a malfunctioning loyalty implant. So Triaka got defensive there, and it should have been settled with the officer removed. The attitude and behavior of your captain was still extremely dismissive and disrespectful, but i can see how the officer issue wasn't enough to disobey.

Still, your complete lack of ability to admit any form of fault for the situation is exactly how your captain acted IC. You're even trying to turn it around and threaten me with a counter-complaint. I just wanted you to admit the poor behavior and apologize, now I'm uncomfortable with you having a command whitelist to begin with...

I take major issue with you using your loyalty implant and captain status as a 'get out of criticism free' card. Your loyalty implant does not grant you impunity to do whatever you want. You still have a responsibility to your chain of command, and you disregarded that completely.

[UnknownMurder]

This is what i was talking about. You refuse to admit any form of fault or that you had any part in why there was so much tension.

I am refusing to admit the death of the Security Officers being my fault. I am only refusing to accept that blame. Are you trying to get me to accept the blame for their deaths for disobeying my orders? I told them one simple order and only one simple order, get to the security. You're blaming this on me for attempting to take complete control of Security. Otherwise, what other IC blames are you asking me to take?

 

I had a discussion with Serveris about when it's suitable to disobey the Captain as a Head of Security. It was explained that the HoS is the tactical authority, not the Captain, just as the CMO is the medical authority, not the Captain. If the decision by the Captain is seen as able to cause serious harm, or seriously hamper security operations or security in general, then it can be disobeyed.

You say this. We tried to formulate a plan in the conference room, I did not say we're going to jump the gun and comply with the terrorists without getting Security involved. I dismissed you and let you do what you wanted for about 5 minutes. Look where that got you in. I just don't know anymore about you.

 

I was trying to argue to keep them in the bridge outside the door, for our safety, but you immediately jumped to accusing Triaka of having a malfunctioning loyalty implant.

They can stand outside of the Bridge. They can stand outside of the conference room. Cadmus was already there for our safety. Please do not forget the orders I have given the Security to remain near the brig in habitable areas. How hard was this order?

 

So Triaka got defensive there, and it should have been settled with the officer removed. The attitude and behavior of your captain was still extremely dismissive and disrespectful, but i can see how the officer issue wasn't enough to disobey.

The same can be said on your part. Good to know you're taking the blame on this part. Good on you.

 

I just wanted you to admit the poor behavior and apologize, now I'm uncomfortable with you having a command whitelist to begin with...

That didn't look like it to me. I am also uncomfortable with your roleplay being now. If you wanted to talk this out and reaching to compromise, we could have done that in discord. From the Captain's perspective, how can the Captain expect to run a station if the crew members will not obey him? More importantly, how can you expect the Captain to run a station if no one will listen to him?

 

I take major issue with you using your loyalty implant and captain status as a 'get out of criticism free' card. Your loyalty implant does not grant you impunity to do whatever you want. You still have a responsibility to your chain of command, and you disregarded that completely.

My responsibility as the Captain is to keep the crew safe and productive as well as your responsibility is to keep the crew safe. The conflict lies with our disagreements on handling the issues. I am sure this was because Alberyk ruled it as IC issue when he told you to make a complaint. Who said anything loyalty implants granting impunity to do whatever I want? You're the one who broke the chain of command and violated Corporate Regulations. You would have been charged with insubordination if this case was real life.

You should consider other people's point of views in the thread of how you played the Head of Security in that round.

[sonicgotnuked]

Hi, I was the AI during the round that put me in code YELLOW on the sodium levels.

Let us get started

1. The sequence of events looks correct, hence me observing this fucking mess after I got pew pewed inside my core while AFK.

2. You insulted the captain inside your hiss hiss speak over security comms that I happily translated, hence the code. The captain took this into consideration after he PDA me asking if I was insulting him, I stated it was a translation from you.

3. I watched as security became a mess and the captain trying to make negotiations, and also watched you get picked off.

[TrickingTrapster]

This looks like a huge bit of miscommunication, starting around the ending of the meeting. Most posts here agree on how the meeting went, though with different opinions on the intent of the captain. After cross-examining these posts with the issue posted in the OP, I'm going to have to rule this as the captain's fault, for trying to take charge too early. He did not let the HoS command his own department to stay in the brig, even though the HoS was aware of the demands, and then it seems to have snowballed from there because of the animosity it created.

[UnknownMurder]

He did not let the HoS command his own department to stay in the brig, even though the HoS was aware of the demand

 

Because he was refusing to accept this order.

[TrickingTrapster]

I did take that into consideration, and it has been explained in an earlier post. My decision remains, the captain was on the wrong end there, starting a chain of miscommunication. I'm not handing out punishment, because most of this entire issue is based on IC miscommunication that led to more miscommunication. But my ruling is still the same.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

that seems fair.