[Resolved] Character complaint: the two Jawdats

[Mcspizzy]

BYOND Key: Mcspizzy

Game ID: Anytime either of the two are on.

Player Byond Key: Prospekt1559 and Jackboot

Staff involved: none.

Reason for complaint: my concerns with the two are analogous minus a few parts on prospekts character. they both, seem to have no interest in taking anything serious. an example would be of a recent round, where a wizard was raiding the surface tool storage for tools. i asked for back up and had both the ai and a security robot aid me, as well as jackboots jawdat as a detective. rather that trying to get the wizard to the brig to be questioned, jackboot starts to try and make friends with the wizard, disregarding that he had stolen items, and did not have an ID.

he then did notice the lack of an id, and rushed the wizard with hardly any interaction to the hops desk and demanded that the captain give the wizard an id. Or where jackboots jawdat chases a armed durand, tearing weapons off of it and hitting it with a plastic knife in a public area. there is also the problem that jackboots jawdat is completely unbelievable from an employment view, switching from HoP, CSI, and detective on a whim. one other problem with jawdat as hop, is that he will constantly bait people into slipping up in their work, only for him to try and punish them however he sees fit. anything from deducting pay, to a swirly, or even suspension. all while he does this he will act as carefree as he wants, disregarding any duty he has for hop, or any job.

as for prospekts jawdat, hikmat. not all of these apply to him, he can be a good officer, and sometimes Head of security. rarely will he act in a foolish manner. this however changes the moment that you put them together, where hikmat seems to take on the bad habits of jackboots jawdat. another problem i have with prospekts jawdat, that he has no interest to rp with anyone other than jackboots jawdat. silently looking for antags, only to speak when he needs something, or to make a one liner when people try to talk to him.

i have also noticed that he will at times go afk and not do anything at all. this normally happens on extended. thank you for reading this.

Did you attempt to adminhelp the issue at the time? If so, what was the known action taken by administration/moderation? I did ahelp before i made this post. I wanted to see what staff had to say, and if they could offer advice.

Approximate Date/Time: 8/12/2017 12:54AM EST

[Garnascus]

A lot of this is a little tricky to pin down. Do you have specific round IDs or dates? I will poke both of them to post here.

[Prospekt]

You clearly have never tried to roleplay with me at all. Usually I'm busy dealing with things IC and half the time I let antags off anyways. So honestly, I don't see how this even involves me. And, the only time Jackboot and I are up to the "antics" is usually by ourselves seperated from others unless people find us. We tend to not do it in front of people unless it can't be helped. Also, I go AFK for IRL reasons that I can't even help, y'know it's called having a life. I'll post more on this when I feel like it, but I was just poked about it.

edit: I have to say, from my perspective and a few others. Most of the shit that Jackboot does is harmless anyway.

Edited August 12, 2017 by Guest

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

Jawdat didn't demand anything, nor did he rush the wizard anywhere. He came upon the wizard and noticed he was a guy with no ID. Visitors lose their ID's all the time and I was giving him the benefit of the doubt in being a friendly detective getting his new ID situation handled. I told him to go the HoP desk and he teleported away to the brig lobby, calling for me to take him to the hop office. I escorted him to the hop office weirded out and asked the captain to handle him, then dropped the matter since my job was done until a criminal investigation was needed. Once the wizard starting being a doofus Jawdat was assisting in trying to find and arrest him just like everyone else. Just because I did not immediately try to detain someone with no id does not mean I was being a goofball.

The guy in the durand was told repeatedly to get out. I was hitting with a plastic knife purposefully knowing it wouldn't do any damage, but it would get their attention. No weapons were torn off of it. I think the durand driver ejected the weapons. Another officer gunned it to critical damage with a laser rifle, which got their attention much more effectively.

He does not bait people as HoP. Jawdat only demotes people if they are intentionally bad employees and call him a fuckface or something. He suspends pay if the person says they're quitting, usually shaft miners that want to turn into visitors or said they quit working for the day. He also promotes people and is very generous with access requests if he can assume they won't mess around with it. It sounds like you were on the receiving end of his demotions? Please cite direct incidents.

He is a hopdetective. He is a former IRS agent. He has a major in business and minor in criminal investigations. CSI did not work for him and he is locked in hoptective because I could not justify to myself being CSI as well, so that is no longer an issue. It was only for two rounds before I decided it made his skillset too broad.

I can't speak for Hikmat. I have seen him act a bit silly and just ask him to do it in the holodeck. I do not lock my RP to Hikmat. We talk over the radio but I don't change how much Jawdat focuses on his own work.

Here is his employment record, for reference.

 

Employment Record

Name: Rrazujun Rrhazkal-Jawdat ID: 07C4

Sex: male

Age: 34

Fingerprint: b35daafe14e8aea7ba870a35fa80e207

Physical Status: Active

Mental Status: Stable

Employment/Skills Summary:

2.3.2426

Born.

6.2.2442

Age: 16. Entered People's Youth Patriots organization. Earned merit badge for punctuality.

4.3.2444

Age: 18. Gained Associate in Accounting in Nal'Tor Community College, Adhomai Continued schooling for Bachelors in Business with minor in Criminal Forensics.

8.1.2444

Age: 18. Employment as a clerical assistant in the People's Republic Internal Revenue Service.

11.7.2457

Age: 21. Gained Bachelors in Business from Nal'Tor Community College with minor in Criminal Forensics.

1.9.2448

Age: 22. Promoted to Criminal Investigation Special Agent. Handles tax fraud for the PRIRS.

4.5.2450

Age: 25. Employment with Nanotrasen begins. Internal Affairs intern for NMSS Odin, Tau Ceti.

4.5.2452

Age: 26. Promoted to Detective.

1.12.2456

Age: 30. (Houssam) Rrazujun Rrhazkal-Jawdat granted promotion to Head of Personnel, managing delegation of civilian departments.

2.3.2457

Age: 31. Gained a Masters in Business Management in the Biesel University of Business.

AUTHORIZED FOR:

Head of Personnel, Chef, Detective

CCIA Actions / Records:

This terminal is not authorized to print CCIA records and/or notes

 

He should not be chef because he sucks at cooking, so that will be removed asap.

Edited August 12, 2017 by Marlon Phoenix

[Prospekt]

In all honesty as well. I can't see how this even involves me or makes me valid for a complaint.

1. I don't recall it being generally against the rules to go AFK sometimes, I don't even do it that much unless I have to.

2. Acting a little bit silly? I've yet to see 1 person on server who is 100% seriously all the time. I have my little unharmful gimmicks that I do and believe me if they were rule breaking I'd have been bwoinked about it already.

3. Like I said, you've most likely never actually tried to or have even engaged in roleplay conversation with me. Because, other than Hikmat's cousin, he will have conversations with other crew members. You just can't expect him to come up to you and engage first, he's not that type of character. You also have to realize, he doesn't like anything non-Taj. While he'll still interact with them and bare with them, he won't go out of his way to say "What's up?" To someone other than another Tajara. You can't blame someone for not roleplaying if you don't genuinely try to roleplay with them yourself. Because believe me if you tried to, I would've definitely had a conversation/etc.

Finally, unless I've actually broken the rules or have done something to even warrant a complaint please take me off of this since I'm irrelevant and have nothing to say for Jackboot as he implied, he has nothing to say for Hikmat/myself except that he's told me to take my sillyness to the holodeck (which I've done).

[Faris]

1. I don't recall it being generally against the rules to go AFK sometimes, I don't even do it that much unless I have to.

 

 

Just want to point out that going AFK for extended period of times is generally frowned upon, and if done consistently may result in administrative action. If you plan on going AFK for longer than twenty minutes, it's advised you return your equipment and head to cryo. We've often had to kick people off the server in order to permit they be cryo'd for being AFK for an extended period of time. There are a limited number of roles available, which is especially problematic with our boom in population.

[Prospekt]

1. I don't recall it being generally against the rules to go AFK sometimes, I don't even do it that much unless I have to.

 

 

Just want to point out that going AFK for extended period of times is generally frowned upon, and if done consistently may result in administrative action. If you plan on going AFK for longer than twenty minutes, it's advised you return your equipment and head to cryo. We've often had to kick people off the server in order to permit they be cryo'd for being AFK for an extended period of time. There are a limited number of roles available, which is especially problematic with our boom in population.

I've never really been longer than 20 minutes, maybe once. But, usually if I know I'm going to be gone that long I'll cryo.

[Faris]

Wasn't an accusation, just putting our stance out there.

[Prospekt]

Wasn't an accusation, just putting out stance out there.

 

I know bby

[NoahKirchner]

The Jawdats are occasionally pretty memey. I saw one of them put on a clown mask and sit in a wheelchair, blasting themselves up and down the hallway with fire extinguishers. Beyond that though they normally just say that they're going to play traditional Admohai music in the bar/holodeck and then play the tetris theme on a minimoog or get injured and come into medbay.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

Can you say how many times you've seen these happen? Because I haven't raced in the halls, just the race track in maintenance. The minimoog is great, and I will not apologize for using it.

[NoahKirchner]

Can you say how many times you've seen these happen? Because I haven't raced in the halls, just the race track in maintenance. The minimoog is great, and I will not apologize for using it.

 

It was once, one of the Jawdats was playing the minimoog in the holodeck while the other one was going up and down the halls in a wheelchair on either side of the holodeck. They then went inside the holodeck, sat there, and the AI bolted the doors. The Jawdat in the wheelchair then blasted into a window (still inside the holodeck) and broke a panel of glass, and that's when I walked away back to the medbay.

Note: Wasn't a race, there was nobody else doing it.

[Prospekt]

Can you say how many times you've seen these happen? Because I haven't raced in the halls, just the race track in maintenance. The minimoog is great, and I will not apologize for using it.

 

It was once, one of the Jawdats was playing the minimoog in the holodeck while the other one was going up and down the halls in a wheelchair on either side of the holodeck. They then went inside the holodeck, sat there, and the AI bolted the doors. The Jawdat in the wheelchair then blasted into a window (still inside the holodeck) and broke a panel of glass, and that's when I walked away back to the medbay.

Note: Wasn't a race, there was nobody else doing it.

Lmao, the window wasn't even broken. Plus that was me, I was fucking around because admins spawned me a hat that I couldn't take off which had my clown mask stuck on. IIRC not a lot of people were on and it was in the holodeck. I blasted around on a wheel chair ONCE around the holodeck before going back inside because I wanted to see how far I can actually move on the wheel chair with a fire extinguisher. Honestly, how can you even complain about the minimoog? It's a piano that plays music, regardless if it was tetris or not (which I don't even remember it being tetris, he played the theme of the dark side from star wars for the liberal adhomais) did it really break your immersions that much?

Regardless, Jackboot and I have halted all "memey" things from now on since people want to be fun police. Even though we legit only do it either on lowpop or secluded in maintenance. I guess as long as there's aurora there's always something to complain about, huh?

[NoahKirchner]

Can you say how many times you've seen these happen? Because I haven't raced in the halls, just the race track in maintenance. The minimoog is great, and I will not apologize for using it.

 

It was once, one of the Jawdats was playing the minimoog in the holodeck while the other one was going up and down the halls in a wheelchair on either side of the holodeck. They then went inside the holodeck, sat there, and the AI bolted the doors. The Jawdat in the wheelchair then blasted into a window (still inside the holodeck) and broke a panel of glass, and that's when I walked away back to the medbay.

Note: Wasn't a race, there was nobody else doing it.

Lmao, the window wasn't even broken. Plus that was me, I was fucking around because admins spawned me a hat that I couldn't take off which had my clown mask stuck on. IIRC not a lot of people were on and it was in the holodeck. I blasted around on a wheel chair ONCE around the holodeck before going back inside because I wanted to see how far I can actually move on the wheel chair with a fire extinguisher. Honestly, how can you even complain about the minimoog? It's a piano that plays music, regardless if it was tetris or not (which I don't even remember it being tetris, he played the theme of the dark side from star wars for the liberal adhomais) did it really break your immersions that much?

Regardless, Jackboot and I have halted all "memey" things from now on since people want to be fun police. Even though we legit only do it either on lowpop or secluded in maintenance. I guess as long as there's aurora there's always something to complain about, huh?

I don't care about the minimoog at all. The clown mask guy repeatedly going up and down the hallway with two fire extinguishers in a wheelchair was a bit immursion breaking though.

[Prospekt]

It was once, one of the Jawdats was playing the minimoog in the holodeck while the other one was going up and down the halls in a wheelchair on either side of the holodeck. They then went inside the holodeck, sat there, and the AI bolted the doors. The Jawdat in the wheelchair then blasted into a window (still inside the holodeck) and broke a panel of glass, and that's when I walked away back to the medbay.

Note: Wasn't a race, there was nobody else doing it.

Lmao, the window wasn't even broken. Plus that was me, I was fucking around because admins spawned me a hat that I couldn't take off which had my clown mask stuck on. IIRC not a lot of people were on and it was in the holodeck. I blasted around on a wheel chair ONCE around the holodeck before going back inside because I wanted to see how far I can actually move on the wheel chair with a fire extinguisher. Honestly, how can you even complain about the minimoog? It's a piano that plays music, regardless if it was tetris or not (which I don't even remember it being tetris, he played the theme of the dark side from star wars for the liberal adhomais) did it really break your immersions that much?

Regardless, Jackboot and I have halted all "memey" things from now on since people want to be fun police. Even though we legit only do it either on lowpop or secluded in maintenance. I guess as long as there's aurora there's always something to complain about, huh?

I don't care about the minimoog at all. The clown mask guy repeatedly going up and down the hallway with two fire extinguishers in a wheelchair was a bit immursion breaking though.

Dog, it was one time. Quit over exaggerating.

[NoahKirchner]

Lmao, the window wasn't even broken. Plus that was me, I was fucking around because admins spawned me a hat that I couldn't take off which had my clown mask stuck on. IIRC not a lot of people were on and it was in the holodeck. I blasted around on a wheel chair ONCE around the holodeck before going back inside because I wanted to see how far I can actually move on the wheel chair with a fire extinguisher. Honestly, how can you even complain about the minimoog? It's a piano that plays music, regardless if it was tetris or not (which I don't even remember it being tetris, he played the theme of the dark side from star wars for the liberal adhomais) did it really break your immersions that much?

Regardless, Jackboot and I have halted all "memey" things from now on since people want to be fun police. Even though we legit only do it either on lowpop or secluded in maintenance. I guess as long as there's aurora there's always something to complain about, huh?

I don't care about the minimoog at all. The clown mask guy repeatedly going up and down the hallway with two fire extinguishers in a wheelchair was a bit immursion breaking though.

Dog, it was one time. Quit over exaggerating.

I wouldn't have noted it if it was one time, but this is my word against yours at this point, so it will get nowhere.

[Scheveningen]

Regardless, Jackboot and I have halted all "memey" things from now on since people want to be fun police. Even though we legit only do it either on lowpop or secluded in maintenance. I guess as long as there's aurora there's always something to complain about, huh?

 

If a tree falls in the woods and there's nobody around to hear it crash down, did it happen at all? Mildly interested in how you two would answer that.

In no way should anything I am going to say supposed to be taken as actionable by any staff member handling this complaint on both players, but I'm going to touch on a few things I have observed from both. The intention of what I'm going to dote on about is what both players should generally keep in mind as neither of you are strangers to this server, what the rules are, and under what limitations both of you should abide by should you choose to try and bend them.

I also generally advise you both to avoid the mindset that you must deconstruct every point that will be made, as stones are stones and you should avoid seeing a stone for anything other than how it is physically significant to you, and how you can learn from that. Doing otherwise undermines the other side's attempt at solving a problem they have with you, and generally inflates the size of the problem further from their perspective. Please don't assume the OP is pursuing to have you both banned, because I think you both could generally benefit from this conversation. Avoiding to have it may cause the inverse and generally worsen impressions further.

Jackboot.

- You have been observed making announcements both as a head of staff and as an AI during primetime + near dead hour with the contents of "Do not be alarmed."

I think such an announcement that happens once during an emergency when done by an antagonist is particularly funny. It has a social commentary of its own that makes fun of the situation where everything is actually burning down. The problem is that a joke slowly stops being funny each consecutive time it is told, and riveting situational commentary only has its greatest effect when its exact polar opposite is true, in the case where this ironic "joke" of an announcement is being made during periodic points in the round typically when nothing is going on. It serves as generally being more of an RP nuisance than anything else, and making yourself out to be a nuisance repeatedly causes the general atmosphere of what constitutes as "mildly serious yet tolerant of occasionally goofy roleplay" to shatter for specific moments.

There is nothing wrong in trying to be funny to break the occasional dark flavor that accompanies a simulation where murder, gore and other darker themes come into play, but doing so in an obnoxious manner and also using methods like abusing the announcements systems as a head of staff and/or AI in order to do so is particularly irksome. You should respect other people's immersion before you think about doing this.

- You have a habit of injecting postmodernist/ironic humor into roleplay. To the point where it's obnoxious.

I don't mean to sort-of say that twice, since I touched on this a bit in the last paragraph, but I really need to say why it is irksome and harmful in its own way to the atmosphere of roleplay.

Particularly when you play as Jawdat -- I have not seen you do this on any other character, as a note, most of my concerns are how you play Jawdat -- you ('you' as in Jawdat', but as he is your character you should accept a degree of responsibility for their actions if they happen to be immersion-breaking in nature, you still drive the character yourself) inject varying topics of humor into conversation, but the one that bugs me the both is the amount of the forced jokes your character makes. To draw a contrast, Poslan does this, for instance, but Poslan tends to be tasteful and while he's notorious for being a puncat, he still does it in a way that is chuckleworthy and not forced. I've seen and heard of Rrazjun-Jawdat lie to a security cadet that he needed his appendix removed through surgery just because the cadet got knocked out in a holodeck boxing match. Jawdat has also eaten 20-40 plates of food the chef cooked up through an exploit with forks, generally just being a dick IC by invalidating all of the work the chef spent their own time and investment on cooking up for more than just you.

You (as a player) seem to have very little empathy or concern for how your characters' actions affect other characters in IC.

I am not implying you should be as emotional and sensitive as a senior high-school girl.

I am implying you should be doing better than disconnecting yourself when someone brings up an issue that involves you in some capacity in which the other person trying to engage you legitimately wants to settle the issue and help you and themselves grow as people. You do this - a lot. It is bewildering sometimes to see you respond to degrees of criticism to only answer, "It's not an issue. You shouldn't be having an issue with it. You're being sensitive."

I'm implying you should try harder to seem like you care. I like you, Jackboot, you're legitimately good at your job as a loremaster and I'd be so bold as to consider you a friend, this was really hard to write out because I do not enjoy being a critic of a friend.

As for Prospekt.

Cue "it's no secret X and Y don't get along." I am going to be blunt with you, because I find the way you interact with other people shocking.

You have a problem NOT taking criticism as an assassination attempt.

You have a problem discerning when and where it is appropriate to be an asshole. You have no "off" setting nor a filter.

You have a problem where you just outright insult someone and act very surprised when someone talks back, you then backpedal and attempt to flip the tables on the other person when you were the one being inflammatory in the first place.

You have a problem keeping IC in IC and OOC in OOC. I've witnessed many instances where your character Hikmat coincidentally has many similarities in their character traits with how you conduct yourself OOCly. This last point is most definitely going to get attacked by you since it kinda does imply Hikmat is a self-insert by proxy of personality, which is unfortunate.

I generally cannot offer suggestions as to why the above four are, as that would involve an in-depth look in real life territory, but I digress. In this thread and otherwise, Prospekt, you have shown a general disinterest in listening to other people when they have something to say about how you conduct yourself. I am not suggesting you believe what anyone has to tell you at face value, but generally civil people should explain to other people in an equally civil manner why they disagree with another person on how one player should conduct themselves as a minimum standard while on this server. And I hope you read most of the parts particularly pointed at you, instead of just skipping to the bottom for a tl;dr, I don't usually write those except for the S&I forum.

Otherwise I don't have much to touch on. I have significantly less issues with how Jackboot conducts himself contrasting with how Prospekt chooses to conduct himself, the former can be solved by him just outright saying, "Alright, I'll consider it."

Whereas the latter's gonna need a bit of work from Prospekt himself. A man can't be expected to change his ways in a single day, so I wish him luck on that. I genuinely fear he's going to blow up one day and say something he cannot take back.

[Prospekt]

As for Prospekt.

Cue "it's no secret X and Y don't get along." I am going to be blunt with you, because I find the way you interact with other people shocking.

You have a problem NOT taking criticism as an assassination attempt.

You have a problem discerning when and where it is appropriate to be an asshole. You have no "off" setting nor a filter.

You have a problem where you just outright insult someone and act very surprised when someone talks back, you then backpedal and attempt to flip the tables on the other person when you were the one being inflammatory in the first place.

You have a problem keeping IC in IC and OOC in OOC. I've witnessed many instances where your character Hikmat coincidentally has many similarities in their character traits with how you conduct yourself OOCly. This last point is most definitely going to get attacked by you since it kinda does imply Hikmat is a self-insert by proxy of personality, which is unfortunate.

I generally cannot offer suggestions as to why the above four are, as that would involve an in-depth look in real life territory, but I digress. In this thread and otherwise, Prospekt, you have shown a general disinterest in listening to other people when they have something to say about how you conduct yourself. I am not suggesting you believe what anyone has to tell you at face value, but generally civil people should explain to other people in an equally civil manner why they disagree with another person on how one player should conduct themselves as a minimum standard while on this server. And I hope you read most of the parts particularly pointed at you, instead of just skipping to the bottom for a tl;dr, I don't usually write those except for the S&I forum.

Otherwise I don't have much to touch on. I have significantly less issues with how Jackboot conducts himself contrasting with how Prospekt chooses to conduct himself, the former can be solved by him just outright saying, "Alright, I'll consider it."

Whereas the latter's gonna need a bit of work from Prospekt himself. A man can't be expected to change his ways in a single day, so I wish him luck on that. I genuinely fear he's going to blow up one day and say something he cannot take back.

 

Honestly, I have to agree with you. I have no filter (which I've realized and I'm now working on not being a complete asshole). Most of it is me not taking anything serious and just blurting out insulting shit because I didn't care about anyone's opinion on me. I too fear I'm going to say something that I won't be able to take back, so from this point forward I accept your criticism and will try my best to change, but I'd rather not write a multi-paragraph essay on how I'm going to change and I'm not going to note all of your points because actions are louder than words. So, I've considered everything you've said regardless of answering to some of the points except the first and second and I will most definitely take this seriously. Thank you for pointing out all of this as most others would just simply keep quiet and not say anything at all. For that, I respect you on that part.

edit: idk why its including this in the quote

[nodnodnod]

The worst I've witnessed from the Jawdats (I don't remember which is which, but it's when both are on) is one of them doing something utterly stupid and screaming for help from the other one and playing the victim when they caused the problem in the first place. But.. I'd always considered that an IC thing that would very quickly get them both fired from sec/command roles if you filed an IA complaint and not really an OOC issue. That's pretty much all my input I have on this.

[Doc]

I have input regarding Hikmat Jawdat, played by Prospekt, as I have just got out of a round where I had a rather unpleasant encounter with them. I had been playing a Ninja who, basically, had just been a huge pest to try and get security riled up for the hell of it, breaking into places like the armory and vault and spacing their equipment. Eventually, RnD started producing Lawgivers, laser gatling guns, and it was clearly getting out of hand for an antag whose gimmick was more supposed to be a little shit than a massive threat to the station- focusing more on talking and interacting with the different departments regarding the items she planned to steal and had stolen, to stimulate RP, rather than just going and fighting them. In the end, she ended up making a deal with the Captain at the time, Raymond Hawkins, to try and tone down the drastic amount of force that had been brought to bear, with all-access Sec officers with high-explosive weapons running around looking for her. The Captain agreed, with the stipulation that he would have one armed guard, and my ninja agreed as well. They met, they talked for a minute or two, and the Captain decided they could comfortably talk alone, asking the armed guard, Hikmat Rrhazkal-Jawdat, to leave the room.

Of importance is a bit of context. While the ninja had stolen armory weapons, vault weapons, the Captain's laser gun, and even the nuclear authentication disk, all of that had been returned. Every single item. She's a little shit, but she's not suicidal, and that was what was necessary to keep the situation from spiraling into a murder-fest. As far as anyone on the station knew at the time, she was completely unarmed, as every weapon she had held at any point was now back in security. Her only capability would be to teleport away, run, and hide- possibly try to steal back those weapons, however, they would all now be under heavy watch as they would know that's the only thing she could do.

Hikmat was asked to leave the room, and proceeds to turn around and ion blast her, shoot her with a high-explosive Lawgiver round, then open the door for another officer with lethals to come in so they can both begin shooting her to death. Given broken bones, massive trauma, and the obvious intent of the security officers to kill her, she activated her self-destruct and blew half the room apart.

Hikmat did this against the Captain's direct orders, attacking and killing an effectively unarmed and completely compliant perp sitting at the Captain's own desk in the middle of negotiations.

To be quite honest? I found it interesting. It was interesting to see Raymond get upset, to see the repairs and the effect the explosion had on the round, to see how security felt about the way their intruder was dealt with, and just to see the rest of the round following that event. I wasn't upset at all with actually dying. The issue isn't what happened, it's why it happened. Hikmat claimed that he "didn't want her to escape again," after they had just had an extensive discussion about how neither of them intended the situation to escalate to such a point, how neither of them wanted to continue the escalation, and how she would be open to conversation with trying to deescalate the issue, after she had already taken multiple steps to deescalate the situation herself, and after the Captain had already explicitly told the security team that he intended to fix the situation peacefully.

That's just bad roleplay. I can't imagine any rational individual hired as a security officer being able to come to the convoluted conclusion required to think that killing an unarmed and compliant serial burglar who had peacefully presented herself to security and the Captain, doing so against the Captain's orders, in front of the Captain himself, ever being a functional member of security. At best, it's staggeringly bad roleplay, at worst, it's incredibly blatant antag-hunting to the point of ignoring absolute heaps of IC reasoning in order to kill the antagonist.

Edit: Also, later in the round, while I was ghosting, Hikmat was boxing in the holodeck for about five-ten minutes as someone was bitten to death by a space carp in arrivals over live comms, as another person asked security to let her out of the security maintenance she had been accidentally locked in, ignoring both pleads for help over general and the Captain asking people to respond to it over security while he boxed with someone. After he had already been put on extremely thin ice over the ninja killing.

[Prospekt]

I have input regarding Hikmat Jawdat, played by Prospekt, as I have just got out of a round where I had a rather unpleasant encounter with them. I had been playing a Ninja who, basically, had just been a huge pest to try and get security riled up for the hell of it, breaking into places like the armory and vault and spacing their equipment. Eventually, RnD started producing Lawgivers, laser gatling guns, and it was clearly getting out of hand for an antag whose gimmick was more supposed to be a little shit than a massive threat to the station- focusing more on talking and interacting with the different departments regarding the items she planned to steal and had stolen, to stimulate RP, rather than just going and fighting them. In the end, she ended up making a deal with the Captain at the time, Raymond Hawkins, to try and tone down the drastic amount of force that had been brought to bear, with all-access Sec officers with high-explosive weapons running around looking for her. The Captain agreed, with the stipulation that he would have one armed guard, and my ninja agreed as well. They met, they talked for a minute or two, and the Captain decided they could comfortably talk alone, asking the armed guard, Hikmat Rrhazkal-Jawdat, to leave the room.

Of importance is a bit of context. While the ninja had stolen armory weapons, vault weapons, the Captain's laser gun, and even the nuclear authentication disk, all of that had been returned. Every single item. She's a little shit, but she's not suicidal, and that was what was necessary to keep the situation from spiraling into a murder-fest. As far as anyone on the station knew at the time, she was completely unarmed, as every weapon she had held at any point was now back in security. Her only capability would be to teleport away, run, and hide- possibly try to steal back those weapons, however, they would all now be under heavy watch as they would know that's the only thing she could do.

Hikmat was asked to leave the room, and proceeds to turn around and ion blast her, shoot her with a high-explosive Lawgiver round, then open the door for another officer with lethals to come in so they can both begin shooting her to death. Given broken bones, massive trauma, and the obvious intent of the security officers to kill her, she activated her self-destruct and blew half the room apart.

Hikmat did this against the Captain's direct orders, attacking and killing an effectively unarmed and completely compliant perp sitting at the Captain's own desk in the middle of negotiations.

To be quite honest? I found it interesting. It was interesting to see Raymond get upset, to see the repairs and the effect the explosion had on the round, to see how security felt about the way their intruder was dealt with, and just to see the rest of the round following that event. I wasn't upset at all with actually dying. The issue isn't what happened, it's why it happened. Hikmat claimed that he "didn't want her to escape again," after they had just had an extensive discussion about how neither of them intended the situation to escalate to such a point, how neither of them wanted to continue the escalation, and how she would be open to conversation with trying to deescalate the issue, after she had already taken multiple steps to deescalate the situation herself, and after the Captain had already explicitly told the security team that he intended to fix the situation peacefully.

That's just bad roleplay. I can't imagine any rational individual hired as a security officer being able to come to the convoluted conclusion required to think that killing an unarmed and compliant serial burglar who had peacefully presented herself to security and the Captain, doing so against the Captain's orders, in front of the Captain himself, ever being a functional member of security. At best, it's staggeringly bad roleplay, at worst, it's incredibly blatant antag-hunting to the point of ignoring absolute heaps of IC reasoning in order to kill the antagonist.

Edit: Also, later in the round, while I was ghosting, Hikmat was boxing in the holodeck for about five-ten minutes as someone was bitten to death by a space carp in arrivals over live comms, as another person asked security to let her out of the security maintenance she had been accidentally locked in, ignoring both pleads for help over general and the Captain asking people to respond to it over security while he boxed with someone. After he had already been put on extremely thin ice over the ninja killing.

 

To be honest, it was 4AM. Jackboot Sircatnip, and I just got done testing the lawgiver. I could've sworn I put it on stun just like Jackboot did before leaving, but I didn't. I had no intend to kill the ninja until I realized it was too late and was probably best to kill them then clone like everyone else does. I ion'd you to disable you then go in for the stun and arrest, I didn't listen to the captain (which I should've) and was issued a warning by staff and it was dealt with.

Regarding the boxing thing, I wasn't aware carp was attacking, the warden and I were boxing. Plus it was the holodeck? I wasn't the only security officer on at the time.

But regardless, no one is perfect man, it was literally 4AM, I was exhausted and shouldn't have been playing. Staff already dealt with it.

[Azande]

Not listening to the Captain in situations like this is garbage, often it is only the Captain/HoS who can save an antag and actually continue the game on if it's within their best judgement. This stops working if you start breaking the chain of command and pretending your underpaid Security Officer has some higher morale agenda.

Has anyone mentioned the continued annoying behaviour of putting labelled papers on people?

[Prospekt]

Not listening to the Captain in situations like this is garbage, often it is only the Captain/HoS who can save an antag and actually continue the game on if it's within their best judgement. This stops working if you start breaking the chain of command and pretending your underpaid Security Officer has some higher morale agenda.

Has anyone mentioned the continued annoying behaviour of putting labelled papers on people?

 

Jackboot literally did that labelled paper thing one round, lol.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

No I do that sometimes with labelled papers like 'energy sword' or 'natural hair color'. It's not something I do often, but it's a fun gag. It's been done by some people since... Aurora was created. I've gotten bwoinks by some staff saying "you gave me a heart attack" but it's not something that's been punished. The holodeck is a self-contained goof allowed zone, but these small OOC gags are done by everyone all the time. It's not a problem of playstyle with the Jawdats, it's a problem with players poking fun at a mechanic.

I have literally no idea what nodnodnod is talking about.

[Scheveningen]

I admit having done that in the past as well. Labelling paper as "energy sword" and hitting windows is something myself and Menown got arrested for and we laughed our asses off in doing it, but on the flip side it is still wrong because it is meta-baiting.

You shouldn't do it more than once.