Skull132

Or as a player guide. Because, your approach probably is not the ultimate one.

Something to ponder upon: for antags, the restriction is generally that "If you see a chance of conflict being generated from you doing X in escape, don't.". Does this apply to sec as well? At the moment, this is undefined by previous precedence, and the given validation is in them responding to action. Depending on how Wyatt conducted himself and how close he got, should he have just backed the fuck off and left it be?

Tracking, will inquire with them tomorrow. Also, fetched the logs. No notices of Raven getting placed inside a disposals unit. Cuffed and stripped -> eeyup. Flushed? Nope. However. The log is generated at the end of the disposals placing process. Game logs cannot confirm whether nor not Hive started to place Lord Raven into disposals. Mostly why I asked for witnesses. As for the relevance of gank, and the little screencap that was posted out of modsay. If the situation is as it was presented to me at the time, then yes, it is a shit thing to do and awful RP. Now, before any of you post walls of text reiterating what has already been said: I've yet to go over the situation in depth, and have yet to confirm whether or not the situation actually is as it was presented to me in modsay. So please, hold yer horses on that count.

Can someone list me folks who were around to witness these events real quick? IC name is fine, I can fetch ckeys as necessary.

Ancient ban. Okay, going to leave it open for like 24 hours for input from other staff if they have any. Otherwise, it'll be lifted tomorrow.

I'll defer to Jenna, Serv, and Lordraven as to what was discussed and why. But note that we have issued the 3-day bans without warnings. The warning announcements are issued when we have reason to believe that something may happen on the shuttle (for example: we have a shit tonne of accounts with 0 days of age on the server, or it's been a really violent round already). Whether or not such a warning is issued does not alter our capacity to enforce this rule, unless you can find a previous precedence wherein we have opted for a light/severe warning instead of a ban, due to no public warning being issued beforehand. Yes, we issue warnings for this, we don't always issue bans. We also issue bans without any prior warnings for the same offence. The decision is generally based on circumstance (what happened, how it happened, etcetera), and on the player's prior history or lack there of. As for sec. We do not punish the individuals who react to such shenanigans, as long as they don't do something hilariously dumb (like detonate a bomb, explosive grenade, whatever).

He wasn't. All cultists involved were.

It already happened ages ago, Arrow. There's been a spreadsheet for this since January 2014, more than two years ago now.

My line of thinking is, as an instructor, I want to spoonfeed as little as possible. I want to give the person I'm instructing the tools to solve the problem, and perhaps an example or two, but the rest they have to figure out on their own with the tools I've given them. Also because it removes the learning curve and other stuff that Arrow mentioned. Arrow's proposal sounds like a great compromise, actually.

Erm, real quick, what are these ideas for specifically? As an ability to gain after consuming another vamp's soul, or as a general power suggestion? Also, I took a bit of a break to tend to family business and friends. Going to be writing the progression system over the next 2 days. Going with linear progression, as majority seemed to like. And I may write the vampire handle proc relatively quickly as well. After that, all I need to manage is the Frenzy code. Which may or may not be !FUN!.

The autopsy data cuold be applied to the head.

I'm not even able to find the old ban, and it's obviously not tripping any mirrors. So it's pretty much lost relevance: it wasn't for anything awful so yeah. Ban lifted.

Application accepted, following a successful trial period.

Make an antag unable to eat his own childe. Or give him the ability to eat one, but just no rewards for that at all. I also kind of want to keep the mechanic: it's supposed to be something that's done rarely, much like siring a new vampire. Also note that the powers should be preferably single time use, and not just give godlike ability. They should be augmentors, like the death and respawn one. Not just, "Extra power, go nuts and kill everyone."

I'm curious, how many people you shot at were sec, and how many were random dudelets?

Doesn't really befit, the force chokey thing. Think of something relating to blood magic, the Veil, Cult, and Nar'sie.

Is it comparable to respawn at a desired location? Probably maybe is. Though on the lower end, I guess.

Considering that consuming a vampire is likely to lead you into a rage, binding it to an object is an awful idea, as you are more than likely going to lose it in that rage.

A standard vampire, IMO, shouldn't be unkillable through the use of standard firepower. Whitewolf makes it quite neat: forget about the ancient bullshit about a stake through the heart and silver swords. Shotguns and grenades are the way to go, if you want to kill one. However, they are immune to disease, pain, don't need organs or limbs, don't die of regular bloodloss, etcetera. Ingame, my thoughts are to replicate the lack of care for organs, disease, brain damage, etcetera. Basically: as a vampire, you won't be adversely affected by damaged organs, you won't get brain damage, diseases (though you will be a carrier) will not have any effect on you either. This would have the amazing side-effect of a vampire being found out by the virtue of all of their internal organs being destroyed, or something else like that. As for vampire v vampire thing, I got a bit of an idea. The way it was originally intended, is that you gain "vampire blood" to use for special powers. Instead, I think giving you the other vampire's soul would be better isntead, that you could use to buy one of a special set of powers. One power would let you become truly undead, making you revive at a place of your choosing. The others would. Idno, what could they doooooo? And thoughts on that approach of managing vampire eating bonuses?

No. This would make playing vampire too hard. In whitewolf, the system works because you can feed very easily: literally just roll a D20 or two to find a victim, and another set of dice to figure out how many points you get out of it. Here, feeding is relatively difficult to pull off, and I do not think frenzy should be linked to it. No. Because setting up a proper Embrace is already hard enough: you need to find and capture two people to do it properly (the target, and a victim with whom to quench the the thirst of the newborn vampire with). It also takes time, setup, and there's a chance of it backfiring immensely by the virtue of the fact that the new childe is not slaved to you. I could make the act of embracing easier, way easier, however, I do not want to do that. That's what thralls are for: simple slaves. Bringing a new vampire into the fold should be an event and a goal, not just something you do as an afterthought. Because of the amount of setup required, having the victim nope out of it because of whatever personal preference shit there exists is a butt move and a half. (Read as: awful sportsmanship.) And I do not like the idea of it.

Hokay. So, in an effort to fix our antag game modes, it was noted that Vampire is relatively broken and just does not at all. Ever. So, I started to rewrite it. I am pleased to announce that I finished the largest block of the rewrite: base systems and powers themselves. Now comes tweaking, and extra mechanics. For the purposes of review, I'll post up the powers and the general approach to vampire that I have taken. Note that while I am looking for input on this as well, it is the second half of this topic which requires more scrutiny at this time. The Mentality: The Powers: The Actual Topic: I have about 2-3 mechanics which are not yet written, and need to be bashed out before doing so. As such, I'd like us to discuss the thoughts I have about them, the possible alternatives, and adjustments. Once I have a general idea of what is wanted, I can put them down into writing. Here they are, in no particular order: Progression! Right now, vampire is handled under linear progression. You have a single level meter, so to speak, and powers unlock as you progress along that scale. The alternative is to handle it as changeling does, where you can buy powers with total blood. Quite a simple preference question, really, both can be done easily enough. Frenzy In the White Wolf games, all vampires have a "beast" inside of them. If a vampire grows too hungry, loses too much humanity, or is for some other reason removed from control, that beast comes up and assumed control. The beast is merciless, and generally kills and uses power without discretion. The most common way to have the beast manifest is by losing all of your blood, and then losing control until the beast has fed on a victim. (The victim usually dies as a result.) Ingame, I don't want to tie to the amount of blood you have left. That would be too inhibiting. The triggers I have figured for the beast are the following: Chaplain stuff (being in the chapel, being attacked by the nullrod, drinking holy water, etcetera) Drinking the blood of another vampire Being a newly embraced vampire (100% chance to trigger, with this one) The way it would work is cumulative. For example: the more time you spend in the chapel, the higher the chance of going into frenzy you have. The effects of being in Frenzy: Locked into harm intent Unable to speak intelligently Feeding requires only level 1 grab, but doesn't erase the memory of the victim Red overlay for the vampire player ??? - Write more suggestions here! [*]Vampire v Vampire Mechanics (Diabliere) I am of the belief that a vampire feeding on another vampire should be a risk-reward type deal. In the White Wolf games, the act is known as diabliere, and it is immensely taboo for the vampire community. It provides extreme power to the vampire that is able to pull it off, but also completely drains their humanity, leaving them practically insane. Ingame, I'd like to make feeding on another vampire have the chance of triggering a frenzy. Further more, I'd like it to give some sort of immense boon to the winning vampire, if he's able to pull it off. But what? An ultimate form type deal, perhaps? Need input on this! [*]Vampire v Chaplain Mechanics All of the religious bruhaha surrounding vampires is pretty much gone in the White Wolf games. A vampire can easily walk into a church, be hit with a wooden cross, or even get a stake rammed through their heart to no ill effect. I would still like to have some interaction of mechanics between the vampires and the Chaplain. As it stands, the Chaplain is immune to Dominate, Presence, Enthrall, and being Embraced. They do not get outright warnings about the former two, but seeing others act strangely should be a clue enough. The chapel is also a place where a Veil walking vampire cannot enter, and as already noted, being in the Chapel, the chance of a vampire frenzying increases the longer they spend there. Religious artifacts also have a chance of triggering frenzy, but it'll be low on if used by themselves. Is there anything else we can come up with, or is this enough? That's it! Input is welcome, go nuts!

A thing I would suggest, however, is to slow down the proposed progression. Things might be moving too slow at this moment, but accelerating them too rapidly will cut out the ability for meaningful development as well. I think two weeks per year would be slightly too fast, no? As an example: let's say the lore team kicks off some revolution somewhere. These events tend to cool down after a year or so, so after 2 weeks, it'd be done and settled. Would this be enough time to develop the story involved?

Ban reviewed per my own prerogative and lifted. The last note prior to this incident was issued 16SEP2015, making it a gap of 7 months with no other violations. Then ban would have been valid if it had happened in a close timeframe after that warning, but after 7 months of no violations it's needless escalation of punishment. Gaps in notes should be treated as conduct that's acceptable in terms of the rules, and should thus completely invalidate old notes. (Minor exceptions made, depending on circumstance, of course.) LordRaven will be counselled on this, and I'll be figuring out why senior staff didn't call shenanigans on a 3 week tempban (when the max temp ban should be 1 week, after that consider perma) and the ban in general.

Here's a catch-22. The antagonists very rarely treat killing someone to have gravity attached to it. The very same thing applies to crew. No one cares. The round based structure of SS13 lends it to this. The mechanics of SS13 lend themselves to this approach. Almost everything about SS13 lends itself to death being an inconvenience at best. Even from an OOC perspective looking at roleplay: how often can you be bothered to roleplay out your character grieving over a lost comrade, with the present structure of SS13? It takes actual effort to do so, and granted, it takes effort to roleplay, but to go through a practiced grieving process for the character every single day is. Draining, I want to say, for the player? Also, there are ways to deal with cloning as an antagonist: anything from hiding the body, to completely destroying it, to destroying cloning itself. If your goal is assassination, without the possibility of cloning, then that can be done. So, either keep death cheap as it is. Or start messing around with the very core essence and structure of SS13 and its gameplay.

Ban was lifted 23APR2016.