Mogelix

Can we expand on these points? Additionally, the uniform locker was removed. So when I spawn with loadout items that override my start items, I literally cannot obtain the blue sec slacks. I have to bring my own uniform (which cannot be that uniform, which i actually like), which just... complicates shit. Why did we change the brig so much? Why did we gank depsecs ability to access said brig? What does that accomplish but weaken a already balkanized and weak sec?

He has a point, if you act like a asshole, people ignore you for being a asshole. Thing is, you have to get into peoples face to make them even consider your existance as a human bean. And, funnily enough, theres middle grounds between, 'asshole character' and 'the nicest guy you'll ever meet character.'. Your not part of their department. They'd talk to you if you were. But they don't. So unless your character is actively bending over for their department, they don't exist for that department. All conversations I've had were confrontational, and I was just minding my own business.

... because there's nowhere to put it. It's a security area. It needs to be secure. A office is secure. Besides. I ICly, know nothing about science. If I'm stuck in science and watch people do shit I don't understand... you don't need a muscleman. The times you do need a muscleman (testing on lings) you just give a guest past or escort the officers.

Except they aren't. They'll condescend you. You have to play a uber-likeable coffee boy sec character to not just be ignored, And unfortunately, human beings, aren't all like that. Or. You could just start with a sec radio/department radio headset. Corporate would consider this. They'd give you that. I don't want to base mechanics on lore but don't nerf them this ridiculously.

There's other ways to do that. That aren't isolating and unfun. You can nerf securities equipment. I'm fine with that. I'm tired of seeing security like soldiers. Now their soldiers propped against departments that usually despise them. This isn't bloody french resistance RP, is it?

But your not a bouncer. Your a security guard. When push comes to shove, your going to have to give up the 'waving at passerbys' game and communicate with sec to defeat a competent and well equipped enemy. And you can't do that without setting up complicated, cumbersome, and flawed things.

I sit around in the brig and chat with my fellow officers, or I leave and patrol the hallways, pop around and greet some departments. I can't do any of that now. I gotta sit in one departments isolated box.

yeah i'll format them correctly EDIT: thank you kind soul who edited them for me for i could not figure out how to copy quotes

1. As a departmental security officer, I don't get access to most if not all of the brig, which will make lone sec just this little bit worse. I also can't access security voidsuits in EVA. Oh look, I ALSO CANNOT ACCESS PROCESSING. Seriously? Why would you deprive officers of the ability to process. Think a little. Not every rounds gonna have a fully stacked security team. 2. The brigs 'calm RP' places have been removed. The bathroom I quite frequently used to change my hairstyle, and I know many used it as a place to easily AFK. I also remember many fun RP interactions between officers occurred in the breakroom. 3. As a result of this PR which was supported for breaking departmental cliques and forcing security to RP more, security is now more isolated then ever. Any comradery they faced with other officers is no longer allowed as that would involve leaving their designated box or using the security radio they don't have. And you don't get much RP with your assigned department because they view you as a stupid brute/a intruder. 4. Departmental security doesn't know what it's doing. They can't call out "Intruder over here!" or they attract the entire station. They can't relay information to security as a whole without alerting everyone to the contents of what they're attempting to relay. 5. Departmental Security also doesn't know what's going on. If their department gets contact with intruders, they're department are the only ones that know, since alerting the rest of Depsec via common may be cumbersome or worsen the situation. Worse even, the few that do have access to security headsets may encounter the antags. So now it's not a situation of "Only security can RPwith the antags" its "Only command and security that has security channel can RP with antags." Really just a bad idea. Drop it. Let it go. It might've been good in your head, but it's not worth enduring this crap. EDIT: Let me just say none of these are fun difficulties. I'm all for including intentional weaknesses of security but this is too much. This. I'm not for maximum efficiency. Security needs to have drawbacks. And that drawback, was access. Their cameras could only see so much. They couldn't get places without a co-operative ID. Their strength, was communication. Something going wrong but don't want literally everyone running to it? Just call out on sec channel. This change flipped it around, Security has access but no communication. And you've fucked with the whole antag balance, which was access over communication Security has gone from a formless mob to a formless mob that can't communicate but is constantly in your face. As a departmental sec, you are not part of that department. You have no clue what they're departments talking about. You're a outsider, a intruder. If you're just a calm dude who hasn't been actively sucking up to every department, your now forced into a position where you either RP with people who will have the same 'lol fuck security' attitude, or you just stay in your office. I don't wanna wave at every person who passes my airlock. That's not interesting or fun at all, and with the new RP standard I doubt I'd get a fucking wave back half the time. How many people need to scream "I DO NOT LIKE THIS" before you realize that sometimes, you will have to revert things or they will damage your servers playerbase. A change should be supported by a huge majority, and this is not a huge majority. There's a huge minority against this, but a small majority for it. That means, alot people are pissed. Those offices are isolated. Don't let anyone tell you anything else. Medbay your not even on the same fucking Z level as the rest. And if you leave your department, your compromising security. If you leave your office, your obstructing people who have jobs to do. And not every characters designed for outgoing RP and behaviour. You can't realistically expect realistic characters to not just sit in their office I really enjoyed just sitting on the front desk of the security lobby greeting people and sorting out small disputes, but now I can't even enter the brig and just chill there because that's against my role. You can't realistically expect realistic characters to not just sit in their office There is a anti-security conspiracy. The snowflakey admins and pandered to "regulars that've never played security over their cutesy waifu characters want security as weak as possible. They've openly stated this. And they do it again. And again. Because its just a joke right? Who'd want to... remove security (or atleast weaken it to the point of inneffectuality) and force a certain RP style on all characters? And yet they are doing that! They're in the process of doing it right now. This test merge causes apathy. Admins blare on OOC on all discussions, "I'm gonna make sure this gets through! It's already through, give up!" It's fashionable to hate security. And this is going to be the ultimate climax of this pent up anti-sec agenda. We didn't need to make a change this radical. We coulda just done what ziy says. You spawn at the brig (WHICH IS EXACTLY THE SAME), the HOS has the ability to assign you departments, or just not assign departments if that's his doctrine. You keep ALL OF YOUR NORMAL SEC ACCESS. Processing, EVA, but you also get access to atleast the main hallway + sublevel of that department. Some sort of limited keycard modification device. But no. Of course we didn't do that. Instead, we got this isolated box office crap. I'm for change. I'm not for this change. But we're just paranoid! We were just so reactionary, of course it wouldn't be thaaaaaaaat bad! Right? Truth is, even sec mains, have brains. They've played sec. They know sec. They know departmental relations, and they know that this is the best way to isolate security. What's next? Are we just gonna let every department start with one stunbaton, a taser and handcuffs, replace the holodeck with a mob rule prison? And look fowl, it didn't. Last round I played, captain just shouted "Non security personell is not allowed here and here." We excluded people from danger zones. And now, even internal and stealthier antags won't have any breathing room as they now aren't under attack by cameras, they've got a officer goosestepping up to them if they litter. I'm against this on so many fucking levels. It defeats the reason I play sec, and as you can see, it's not because I like watching antags suffer.

+1 is good does good RP things unlike some other people with command whitelists, and is competent ICly.

Looks good, I've RPed with their characters once or twice and they're all fine. I have similar problems doing char emotions so... +1

+1 Good at RP, good at gameplay, good at security, cool dude. Can't say much that hasn't already been said, just wanna voice my support.

Assistants should either have a outlined focus or be more trusted to do interney stuff. They shouldn't have any of the shit in this initial suggestion, though.

1. No. This would mean mostly useless assistants have the same level of maintenance access as sec officers, and more then scientists and doctors. Assistants can 'be whichever department they want' or they can be just 'hapless civilian'. If you choose to not do anything and just stand around, you shouldn't also have the privilege of hiding in maintenance as a antag. Intern roles exist if you want more access to the department you're focusing on, and if you need to change from assistant to intern, contact a Head Of Personnel if possible. 2. No. That literally exists only to stop all the tools being taken by people who don't need them. 3. No. Either you're lucky and you find electronic tools that assist in door hacking, or you don't. No 'increased spawn chances' to hand hold the people too lazy/not accepting of the responsibilities that come alongside becoming a departmental intern. 4. To a very limited extent, please. I doubt NT would let assistants get their hands on power tools in the first place, and I don't wanna start seeing snowflakes with steampunk aesthetics running around with welding tools. 5. No. This is a HRP server. It literally makes no sense for a human to forget how to do anything but kill destroy death. Wrestling manuals are already kind of memey, let's not also throw in nods to 'le epic greytide'.

Hey, sorry for being aggressive, I can see why you'd take it like that. Raddems are extreme, but many characters are also extreme. The only reason they're not tearing out their political opposition's throats throats is self antagging rules. Now, obviously, I don't think the unions will act like this outside of antag rounds, but it will become /extremely tedious/ for security to deal with these minor, repetitive, mind numbing, barely unique or character developing things like 'unga me want pay-rise' or 'bunga let me hack vending machines despite having a chef giving out (usually) free food.'

Not a single flaw, controversy or issue with the unions is stated. Meaning they are 'perfect'. Its a Mary Sue organization, and the morality of defensive but greedy and bloated corporation vs active and aggressive yet flawless workers union, paints a picture of good vs evil morality that is going to be done to death by union agitators, which I think is really one sided.

Again, this is a small research station in Tau Ceti space. Revolution rounds come off as over the top and often don't make good trains of thought: Sol annexed Biesel, therefore I kill NT command. But let's say, security cracks down on the union. After a long, drawn out battle /standoff against the cargo anti authority snowflakes, security has most if not all of them in cuffs. What then? Fire them all? I'd love to, but it comes off as a waste of a character. No one on the station, people who might've developed meaningful relationships with the character, can interact with this char because their now no longer on the station. Or maybe let them keep their job with a negotiated punishment, so the very next round, they can do the /exact same thing/, or encourage others to do /the exact same thing./ We can't force character development related to the trauma of getting your ass beat by police, so what's to stop them consistently being terrible? Again, all this does is make lore justified self antagging. What do you mean by the "the objectives and goals of each faction already follow existing meta"? Its bad enough we have to deal with one snowflake anti-authority figure who hacks vending machines, disagrees with security even if it'd cost them their life, and disobey command, why make it more then the meta for that character and instead the meta for a sizeable chunk of characters? Rewarding snitches? Or as has been previously stated, some kind of player opposition to the unions? Jackboot, if you wanna host a canon rev event where the revs and loys have to be just a pain in the neck and not change anything on the station, be my guest, but don't make every round a rev round. I know your FAQ hasn't come out, but it seems like you've already made up your mind.

I really don't want this. Sorry to come off as anti-fun but the last thing this server needs to do is encourage 'hoho, I'm so quirky cocky and rebellious' type characters. These unions have no downsides and seem to be one hundred percent 'the good guys.' All this does is encourage border line self antagging, as theres more tension between 'good guy working people' and 'evil rich security/command' This will make this angsty rebellious cesspool of a station more divided and chaotic then ever, as command can't deal with actual threats cause suddenly the union demands a payrise. This could make a good rev round back story kind of thing, but dealing with this every round? Haha, no. EDIT: How about we flesh out Sol culture lore, before we start with Sol 'fires of revolution'. EDIT 2: Maybe just make GAIA into a commonly referenced thing without starting stupid rebellious stuff, like a normal left leaning party? Everyone won't shut up about ATLAS cause they're actually interesting and keep doing stuff, while GAIA just sits in a corner watching Sol get torn apart by ATLAS. EDIT 3: or we could become a kaiserreich meme, Syndicalist gang.

10/10 can make jokes under duress. nah seriously good guy should be more then a trial, consistently good at his job.

he is a epic gamer who is infinitely more competent at his department then I will ever be at mine :( +1

I'd prefer a rate closer to 65% to 35%, personally. TCFL should be more common but shouldn't make ERT rare.

thank you pwate you just lowered my blood pressure, and that's a point I was too enraged to point out, it says your uncuffing but then it doesn't uncuff you when the timer ends

This is a stupid change and I am incredibly fucking livid. I just managed to escape from a chair atleast three times, but all three of those times I was only unbuckled and my cuffs remained on. I was then promptly immediately re-buckled. Antags in prison have pretty slim chances to escape already. Officers do the wardens job and oversee every little thing you do, you're often denied your PDA even if nothing evidences you having uplink on your PDA, and over all its just a terrible experience that comes down to 'kill yourself or get permabrigged'. This change even worsens the experience, for a reason that I am told to be 'So you can leave someone who's in cuffs for longer then a minute'. This strays from the entire point of cuffs. They're meant to be a temporary restraining device, not a portable prison. A better change would've been to increase escape time to three or even four minutes. This disencourages spamming resist, and encourages choosing your moment to escape. Please change this, I can see the annoyance in resist spammers but this is not the correct method to deal with it. This takes out the suprise of a well timed unbucklecuff resist, as even a passing officer that sees you are not firmly planting your ass on the chair will instantly rebuckle you and reset the whole process. The brig exists for a reason, bucklecuffing is already annoying but this puts me in physical fucking pain as a antag.

Maybe it'd be nice if we stuck with familiar technology? Everything on the station is actually kind of familiar (with the exception of some of the shit in engineering and science). And it's pretty obvious that NanoTrasen likes to make familiar and homely human designs (See the bar, the chefs and you know /the library/)

I respectfully disagree, but arguing for and against paper books is a discussion for a different kind of forum. How about you allow people to make books into either little projectors or printed books? With their own ups and downs. Seriously removing paper books is a really radical change, that conflicts with the reasons many people visit the library, for a homely and safe little hideaway. It would also hurt antags as a internet cafe has even less concealed places and hiding spots then the already incredibly restrictive library. Also, no. Let people chose if they want their job title to be computer technician or librarian. Let people chose if they want to be 'HACKERMAN' or 'woman who has to contact tech support to figure out how to turn on their computer (exaggeration)'