Mogelix

Sweet. Can I have this unjust ban that seems to have taken way longer to handle then necessary removed, please?

Yeah, keep it there. Even if it's just two airlocks, that's still a skill-barrier, and if it takes too long, they (people who shouldn't have fire-axes/aren't authorized for it) can be detected and stopped. Keep shit how it is. Don't let engineering become a combat militia department... or atleast easier to become.

With departmental security, people aren't given a choice. It restricts securities choice of where and when to patrol. It's initial implementation literally ganked the brig to a hilarious degree, that favoured functionality over departmental roleplay. If they remove the brigs break room, they should also remove cargo, medical, science, and engineerings briefing room. As well as all of the briefing rooms except commands. While I totally disagree with departmental cliques, it is only natural for departments to clump together. This isn't a negative thing, or overly unrealistic. People who work in the same field will hang out. Now, I agree security shouldn't just wander the halls of the brig, but they don't. They patrol the station as is, and if they are competent enough to request a guest pass (a ridiculously underused yet useful mechanic that is handwaved away because people simply don't bother to use it despite it singlehandedly resolving this entire non-issue.) to patrol departmental halls and roleplay with people in their very own department. That is sufficient implementation of 'departmental security'. Security requesting to be allowed to enter your department, or demanding access if they have a warrant. Warrants, by the way, will become nearly completely useless with departmental security. While I agree that any sane company would want this transparency in their departments, OOCly, it just restricts the player too much, security and non-security antagonist. There's a contradiction in sentiment that justifies departmental securities interaction with antagonists. "Security is too LRP in it's interaction with antagonists, and their hordelike mentality in chasing antags from the brig is the root cause." "I want LRP hordelike security in my department so I can attempt HRP interactions like bribing or distracting." What do you think is going to happen? The only reason you don't deal with dumb shitter officers in your department is the lack of departmental security. If security is so bad, why do you want them in your department, just so you can get some shining star of HRP/metafriends to occasionally roll the same department you picked and vigorously RP with you? 9/10 times that won't happen because security is dumb. I play security and I think security is dumb. Not because of how it's structured, but because of it's dumb players, like me. If you want to be a officer who goes out, and interacts and roleplays with other departments, (even maybe using guest passes, the still readily available tool that just simply isn't used for no reason), be that guy. There's already people in security who act like such. You know, the people that actually fill the requirement for 'HRP', so why should people who aren't hordelike desk-sitters but who just like having a choice of what they do and where they do it get stuffed over? Reality is, even with 'select a department' security... which you can already do by the way, by getting a guest pass. You know, the thing that keeps you out unless that department actually wants you, many people are just going to set general officer to highest, longing to be able to still do what they please, but prevented from doing so because hypothetically security might possibly grunt out a few extra says worth of roleplay. And I'm not saying that departmental security isn't allowed to leave their department, but they're undeniably going to have to be punished for not obeying the departmental structure, or this idea wont work, and that would mean taking away securities choice. Security is allowed to have choice, just like every other department. Their not a military. They have canonically dealt with stressful situations, but they are entirely civilian. There is no reason to take away their choice. Their not soldiers. All departments have the choice to not RP, but all departments RP. People and officers who don't RP and chase valids and antags are a OOC player problem, not a OOC and IC department problem.

Schev is right on his points against departmental security, and I agree. I less-view the version of dep-sec he has suggested as the 'ideal progressive resolution' and more of the 'least terrible' resolution. I also think Shodans is pretty alrightish too. Nevertheless, departmental security I will never support fully. There just doesn't seem to be compromise on how it will be implemented, especially with how divisive it is. It either doesn't happen, or security becomes fragmented and ganked.

I don't like em. I'm not watching and controlling a movie, I'm roleplaying. I don't need fancy graphics, hurts my head and distracts me from the narrative/roleplay.

Can you clarify what you mean by this? From what I'm reading, no, security was not fucked when I bought guns. We had only had one reported sighting of someone suspicious. Yes. I bought weapons of varying practicality and damage from the merchant to show off, and then held onto them while shit was still quiet, to 'show off'. When shit escalated, I was going a bit too busy rushing to the ninjas location to stop and get non-lethals, and I was never ordered/called to the armory to get non-lethals, so as a result, the robotics scene happened, No. When we started escalating against the ninja, pursuing them, there was one call to the armory (Which I ignored because it did not address me as a armed person) and then we were off pursuing their confirmed location at very hihg speeds after the Wizard crystal-balled them. Once the escalation started and we stopped just messing around and passively/vaguely looking for 'some dude in a black suit', it was all going a little bit too fast for me to have chats with the HOS about my armament. When shit was peaceful, I wasn't told to get weaponry and was just chilling with my sweet guns, ignoring the HOS's snarking out. When shit was escalating, I was never ordered to go to the armory for non-lethals, and was too busy following other orders and rapidly pursuing the ninja with the rest of security ... why not? Tasers and rubbers do nothing/minimal damage against ninja hardsuits as far as I am and was aware, and I didn't have anything else to use. Besides, we were ICly told this thing was a 'black military hardsuit. No-one's at fault here, honestly. IC attitudes lead to different IC issues, that lead to different IC situations, that get a negative IC resolution due to how people addressed said issues and situations. This is how every round goes, it has a IC narrative with IC conflict. And yet despite this all of this being results of IC, I'm being OOCly punished. If you want to make me change the IC attitudes that started this non-issue, to mold this whole chain to... have less conflict (?), the thing antag rounds thrive and expand on, go right ahead. I'm not saying validhunting and ganking antagonists is justified because 'muh conflict', it's just that I didn't validhunt or gank, I just followed the IC chain of interaction and narrative, or as I believed it's called, roleplay. As a end result of this chain, the ninja suicide bombed themself because previous IC issues lead to me being improperly armed to deal with them. This is entirely IC. Mhm. Because I'm not a big scary menace shitsec who just jumps at the chance to kill antags, if I was, my notes would reflect that, and, based on the amount of time I spend on here, I'd already be secbanned. And even if you assess me to be aforementioned shitsec, this would be my first time exhibiting said behaviour. I'm not going to claim to be a 'peaceful officer' but I'm just going to say that I don't think I validhunt.

To continue on this point. I have asked a admin to see my notes and I have looked over it. None of my notes are related to me validhunting antags, the behaviour I've supposedly shown that got me banned from security. Some are related to the way I've attacked and killed pursuing officers as a ninja, others the way I've acted with stolen antag equipment, but not one refers to me improperly escalating, validhunting. Sorry for not editing and adding it on.

I posted this twice and I don't know how to delete it. Help.

Ah, sorry, I thought you meant barbie doll hot pink. Thanks for clarifying, not from America.

mmmmm, I don't know. The way your wording it makes it sound like wehrmacht nazi so and so on. that just isn't how dominia is. Dominia is neither fascist or a dictatorship. Imperial is spot on but I really think you should go for more of a roman type deal then what your describing, though without overlapping colour schemes with Elyra. Also worth noting would be: "Tribunal Commandos An evolution of the Unathi concept of the Guwandi, in the event that a citizen becomes mortally ill, finds themselves lacking the pride, honor, drive to live, or simply become tired of their lot in life, forfeit their possessions and join the religious Tribunal Commandos, a near-suicidal military unit under the Tribunal and Imperial Military’s dual authority. Acting as the vanguard, distractions, and expendable forces, members of the Commandos are expected to die. A dishonored person who joins the Commandos is considered to have regained his reputation while serving in the unit, whether they survive or die in combat. It is not uncommon for young men and women with no real prospects to join the Tribunal Commandos, for a multitude of reasons. A Commando who survives an engagement is awarded a square, bronze battle medal. When ten are accrued, the soldier is offered a choice to remain as a soldier of the Tribunal Commandoe or be honorably discharged. Many members of the secretive Special Operations Group are recruited from the few surviving Commandos. Survivors are allowed to keep their medals and earn the title Ten Medal ‘Immortal Commando of the Tribunal’ as well as being inducted into the Order of Immortals. Surviving members also have their debt, and their children’s debt for two generations, removed with no conditions attached. A soldier who survives ten engagements is very rare." So maybe some sort of choice between the kind of 'Intimidation/domination tactic soldier' you've described and the Tribunal Commandos. Hell, maybe just throw in a middle ground with a normalish soldier type. I have never once previously seen items concerning sol with pink. I'd stick with just a basic green US marine look. Or steal some pages of uniform and urban camo from the HECU units from half-life. Otherwise, looks good!

'clearly said'. He never clearly said "Mutema/people who only have lethals, come to the armoury, dump your lethals, and get these non-lethals.". If you as a HOS, don't give clear orders (Snarking someone out is not a order, and has IC reason to not be followed.), it's silly to not expect adverse effects. You have also, admitted yourself, that me lying is and was a IC issue. If Khaled wanted to, he could've asked the captain and gotten my ass in a lot of trouble, and that's a risk I took. He also, only called "Anyone without a weapon" to the armory. I had three guns. I really didn't fit this criteria. Both orders he gave were either unclear or literally weren't addressed to me. The rules of engagement were not followed because ICly and OOCly I could not reasonably follow it, due to previous IC issues that resulted in me getting lethal weaponry. I didn't even know we set up a ion ambush. Maybe I really overestimate ninja hardsuits, but I don't think rubbers and tasers do well against them. Um, no? They were practically alive and practically suicide bombed themself when they were delivered to a practically fully staffed medbay. 'Practically killing someone' is a oxymoron. If their alive, medical can save them. They even managed to regain consciousness long enough to tell me I was a asshole and activate the suicide bomb. I was also practically forced to escalate on the ninja. The HOS told me to shoot (While Bayer was negotiating and chatting to them.). Bayer didn't have a gun at all, Nova died because of ion memes, plus was out of my sight, and I was poorly equipped for the situation due to previous IC issues, In the stress and speed of the situation, I used the wrong weapon for the job. I actually bought three guns, thanks. My motive to do so was to burn some fishy money on some useless temporary crap, as is IC tradition. The reason it became so weaponry focused is because the merchant only had childrens toys and lethal weaponry in stock (no non-lethals) so I burned my money on said lethal weaponry. IC issue, again. The only one who made any decisions regarding the ninja was the HOS. All of security was not properly armed to deal with this. Allow me to reiterate for the third time, Bayer was a magical nut, Nova killed herself with her weapon, and I was left unattended/without orders, so I bought weaponry. All that culminated in a fucked situation caused by security who was fucked for IC reasons. You know, a IC situation. The problem is, I don't feel like I've done anything extraordinarily unusual, unexpected, or incorrect. I did something stupid, but I didn't do something wrong, because of the reasons stated above. This is all one giant IC issue. You know, regular gameplay. This is very frustrating and tiring to write and it feels like your repeatedly driving me in circles, and as a result, I'm really repeating myself typing this. I beg that whichever admin is reading through this is also reading all the points I've made, even if it might get rambling and repetitive.

BYOND Key: Mogelix Staff BYOND Key: Drwago Game ID: b1E-dFnl Reason for complaint: Unjust, unfairly applied Sec-ban. Evidence/logs/etc: None. I don't even have the Ahelp logs, I can only vaguely remember what it's all about. I don't collect logs and information because I play this game for fun, not to prove points on forums. Additional remarks: This isn't meant to be the body of my argument, but I'd happy to use it as such. I honestly wanted to make this a unban request, but I don't think I'm willing to accept the ban quite yet, especially regarding how situational and contrived the whole thing was. When I tried writing the Unban request, in of which I would accept my punishment and the reasoning behind it, I found myself frustrated because I didn't agree with what I was writing. I see in many other staff complaints, Garnascus simplifies and summarizes the whole thing to a couple of points. It's a handy little thing to explain trains of thought. So, I'd like to give a reasoning to my actions. 1. Join as sec officer. 2. Find lots of money hidden in a fishy briefcase, random maint spawn. 3. Hear unconfirmed rumours of a man on-asteroid with a black military hardsuit. Most of security simply handwaves off. 4. Decide to spend all the money fast, to be consistent to my chars actions and attitude last time he got operations funding. 5. Head to the merchant shuttle upon hearing it be announced on the radio. Note that initially, I was just going to spend money on whatever caught my eye. I was not going to buy weapons exclusively. Bayer begins discussing purchasing weapons out of his own pocket, so I offer to buy them for him. I get some interesting gear, a fire axe and a pocket pistol. 6. As I walk out the merchant dock, the captain approaches me and says that I should buy some EMP grenades. Sure, again, money to spare and dispose of. 7. I ask the merchant if he has EMPs. Nope. 8. Using my money and irritation, I badger the merchant to be taken to his dock and directly browse his wares for EMP grenades. 9. He tells me he has none. So, I flash my remaining six k again and he offers me some bigger guns. He starts browsing on his console, while I'm waiting, I overhear that command has gotten EMP grenades through other methods, and begun distributing them to sec. 10. Buy a x-ray rifle cause again, I want to get spend all this money as fast as possible. I'm not really concerned with the practicality or use of said weapons. 11. The merchant shuttle returns. I return to the brig, and start showing off all my weapons to the HOS and most of security. I lounge around. Bayer get's contracted by the wiz woz. 12. I get mildly snarked out by the HOS about having lethals when there's a non-lethal situation, he asks me if I'm allowed to have them and I ICly tell a half-truth that the captain authorized me getting this weaponry. I honestly just wanted to keep my weapons so I could show them off. 13. We get a rad-storm and I'm practically shoving my guns in the HOS's face, and there's no further objections or orders to stow them. 14. The ninja is sighted, we chase them a bit with the assistance of the wizard. So on, so forth. The Rules of engagement are to pacify. 15. The HOS orders security to briefly fall back if they don't have a weapon to the armory, so they can get weaponry. Note that he doesn't specify a type of weaponry. I am beyond well armed and as such, continue as usual. 16. With co-operation between the wiz-woz and AI, the ninja is located again in robotics. The HOS orders us to surround them. 17. I arrive along with Bayer, who's in wiz woz gear. From my perspective, I'm the only one with a gun. 18. Bayer begins negotiating. I sit around with a comically useless cadet. 19. While Bayer is full on chatting with the Wizard, and I'm distracted, the HOS says to shoot on the count of three. 20. On the count of three, I unload my lethal x-ray rifle on the ninja. 21. Bayer stuns both me and the ninja with wizwoz powers, and Nova (Who I hadn't seen due to my angle in the robotics lab) dies because she used a ion with a synthetic heart. 22. After a little bit of standing around, we drag the surviving ninja to medical. He wakes up and suicide bombs us, calling us assholes Well, the Ahelp came along and I couldn't convince drwago to change their mind so here I am sec-banned. I'd like to say this was totally unfair because I was never ICly directly told to 'drop off my lethals and get non-lethals'. Drwago says that HOS's don't have to babysit officers but they are still a command management role. If they didn't want me to lethally shoot the Ninja, they should have actually done something to ensure I was equipped appropriately, which they didn't, no efforts were made other then snarking me out before we had begun actively chasing the ninja. When I unloaded on the ninja, I didn't see anyone else with non-lethals. I also had five seconds to organise myself before I had to shoot, so I shot with what was closest on hand, a lethal weapon. The ninja hadn't even died, granted, it's impossible to tell if i'd have kept clicking even after 'antag horizontal' because Bayer cast a stun spell, but I'd like to remind you, the Ninja survived, and their was a fully functional medical team which I brought them to. This was the ninjas decision to kill themself. If I'd wanted to gank or validhunt the ninja, I'd have picked up my x-ray rifle once my stun worn off and unloaded again, but I didn't, I brought them to medical. Drwago also cited 'various notes and warnings regarding similar behaviour' which I'm simply not aware of. The only recent similar occurence I can think of is when I accidentally shot a raider a little bit too much during a active gunfight in medical, which was a simple heat of the moment impulse. That same round I was praised by one of the raiders OOCly for not escalating a hostage situation, yet a couple of rounds later I'm told that I'm some sort of active well-known validhunter? Last time I got a ticket for 'valid-hunting', I gave my reasoning and admitted to a slight mistake, and I got a 'ok' and the ticket was ended. If the staff team wants to tell me to chill, they should give me a warning informing me. That said ticket also had entirely different context. I shot this ninja due to a OOC misunderstanding of the situation, and I shot that aforementioned raider because I was kind of panicked. In conclusion, even if this Staff Complaint gets nowhere, I'd be satisfied with some peace of mind and clarity as I write my unban appeal. Cheers, sorry if this comes off as brash and rude as I'm writing this rather late. I know it also kind of violates the logs-based nature of staff complaints and the general formatting of it all, but hopefully my points reach you. I'd also rather not make this a lengthy and complicated process, so tell me if my argument is going in circles. Who knows, maybe it already is?

+1 i think if you don't have the creativity to make a new char for each department and just make someone with very minute name differences, RPed the same, with no or extremely similar flavour text, then you should be warned for being LRP, breaking the atmosphere of the game. it's just plain out uncool and totally inappropriate for a HRP server. remember that we're playing characters here. that's the difference between HRP and LRP. HRP you play a character. LRP you play yourself. What's there not to understand? This behaviour negatively affects the RP quality of the server with no upsides for anyone except the person who now doesn't have to make actually new characters.

+1 Yes please! More power for customization, less generic red voidsuits! Personally, for group non-crew types, I'd be settled with a OOC spawn area, which gives you the choice between multiple docks (and equipment/guns within). (Sol Marine type docks, PMC type docks, Vox type docks, syndie type docks that contain uplinks, etc.). Then some sort of chameleon kit-esque equipment selection that kind of 'locks in' once you leave the dock for the first time, (and also actually has that clothings stats, like, armor.) Solo non-crew, do pretty much the same thing, and let them select between mundane and magic, and make silly wizard robes act like chameleon kits. For solo crews, give them a point-based menu for type selection, Like, a OOC uplink for selecting antag powers.. Maybe a rev/group type antag with vamp dominate? A somehow slightly weaker vampire with a weak (Less TC) traitor uplink? A ling that gives up horror form/armblade for more passive effects, say, having a speed/strength drug they can ingest at will. Maybe different types of uplinks with different focuses? Whatever happens, we need to ensure that people follow the gimmick that was agreed on in AOOC + arrange. Let's not let this turn into a 'pick the most powerful setup' kind of deal. This is for varied antag RP. Great suggestion, this is the kind of antag rework we need! andwillnevergetbecauseitwouldbeinsanelyhardtocode

Alright, OOCly, it'd be a headache to deal with Nick. ICly, it'd be a headache to deal with Nick. I ICly dislike Nick for being a asshole. I OOCly dislike Nick for being a 2D Asshole character. The IC and OOC is seperate yet exactly the same. I'm not calling you a liar, I'm just saying, that's the kind of shit people do, they compromise the cohesion and quality of the RP to play their fantasy command staff. It's why we have applications, to OOCly screen people before they go around being big important boys on the station, and yet despite that we still have some pretty low effort command players. That's not the context. We're discussing character and RP quality. If you have sparse time to play a character, it's hard for others to define their quality of RP due to lack of experience with them. With the time I've spent with Nick, I don't like how his character is designed and is RPed. With him in my head as the primary example for your RP, I can't help but think that you shouldn't be command. Okay, thanks. Let's just drop this. I'm going to keep the Minus One cause it's my dead-set opinion. Arguing with me is mostly just annoying the moderator who's going through this crap RN, although it's always good to honestly state your opinion.

He gets suspended on a round by round basis. The only reason he doesn't get Incident Reports is because no one can really bother, too much of a headache, crossing their fingers OOC action will be taken, or that you'll maybe start playing cadet. I'd also like to say that I don't think Nick is a 3d character or a reasonable asshole. He's more of a clown, cartwheeling in and saying what he pleases, doing whatever he feels like, then shouting over comms when he is punished. You have admitted that around 2/3 of your time spent in-game is as Nick. That leaves some pretty thin time slots to play three other characters, which now, one may become Head of Personnel, despite you admittedly, rarely playing them. There's also, nothing stopping you from taking any position you please. You say you won't instantly give Nick HoS, but with a all of command whitelist, who's to say how long you'll play your new bob mcfriendly HoS and HoP, and start rushing to get a half-arsed IC reason to have Nick play HoS.

Exactly this. You need to prove that you can make a good character, promises just don't work. I also severely doubt Nicks ability for redemption, given his current attitude + character direction. Nick, or a similar type of character, would not be a good 'evil command staff', like a proper moustache twirling villain. He'd be more of a loyalty implanted idiot. Less evil, and more just 'incompetent and illegible.' Which just doesn't get hired. I also, and maybe this is just ignorance+ different time zones, but I have never seen Draxler. Maybe he's really good, but should one good character justify giving command privileges to someone with... otherwise miffy characters + recent history? I retain my minus one.

-1 Nick would be barely eligible ICly for his IC attitude. However, he is also barred OOCly, from say, making another character, because his behaviour is persistent over his multiple characters. Some pointers. One time, to put the issue shortly, he released a changeling from it's perma-cell as his detective character, to quote 'let it eat', ( I presume it was a IC friend ) despite it making it clear that it doesn't eat food. He then, as a non-antag hid behind it when it attacked and murdered half of security. I know that the round formula isn't forced crew vs antags, but that's just ridiculous. Nick, at other times, seems averted to interaction with antags, preferring the hyper-efficient murder-arrest method to... basic negotiation and RP. This, I assume, is a extension of his 'careless asshole personality'. A certain type of personality that gets you fired, not promoted to Head of Security. This particular personality is also one that really blocks the whole '3D character' stuff out the OOC equation, because you have to really bend over backwards to see anything but a 2D asshole char. (Not talking about sprites...). Note, that I enjoy a good asshole character, just not one done like Nick. Sorry chief, this ain't it. I don't think I'll be applying for command soon, and I know precisely why I'd be denied. Maybe you should think similarly about a whitelist?

Thank you, Ornias, for articulating what I was trying to say much better then I could. You shouldn't need a role to be a crackhead, you should just have a character... that's a crackhead. This is HRP, it is distinctly, character based. Not MRP, AKA needing the RP to be determined by 'what you roll at roundstart'.

-1 Just add whitelisted non-command RP roles if you want to do this. Alot of these are MRP. we don't need a role to get people to Play Roles. We're heavy roleplay. This is a mechanical solution to a roleplay issue. I would enjoy if people were given the freedom to have a bit more power as a non-antag with 'character gimmicks' though none of these should be the focus of the character, just the job of the character and role they play.

Dont you consider that more then the Loyalty Implant may be at play? "you're still completely you and completely normal except you're a slave to a vampire" If you have a scrap of humanity, even without a loy imp, you may hold back from using lethals.

+1 They're competent and eligible ICly, and competent and reasonable OOCly. The fact of the matter is, I'd rather have a flawed but well RPed character over another mysterious no personality/backstory HoS. (I think she actually has a point with the whole 'we let worse stuff happen' argument. If we allow flawed mediocre chars in, why can't we let in flawed but still good chars. Do we expect perfection from our command?) Even if you disagree with her handling of certain situations or her barely obstructive depressive backstory, she's competent and a good RPer, so at this point I think most of this stuff is just nitpicking, especially when a vast majority of experiences with her are positive for me atleast.

he's not a shitter and is good at rp + a cool guy, chars applying look fine to me +1

The accent annoyed me and put me into mental preparations for 'god, more shitty german chars?' But it turns out he's more then tolerable, actually enjoyable to see and RP with.

I dislike and disagree with most if not all of your opinions regarding security, antagplay and round structure, but totally believe in freedom for antags to be what they want to be instead of 'lol your a pirate buy a chameleon kit if you don't wanna instantly be seen as a intruder'. give them the choice of how and what their antag will be.