Moving flashbangs to armory.

[Coalf]

Exactly what the title says, flash-bangs have no reason to be in the default load-out of every security officer on the station.

Flash-bangs are tactical, breach and clear thrown explosives that serverto blind and disorientate the foe so that he cannot directly fire at the breaching officer.

There is 0 reason for a common, patrolling security officer to have a flash-bang on him.

There are currently 17 (1 in each sec locker, 7 in the common armory box, 4 in the vendor).

That means your normal security officer can get his hands on 17 flash-bangs and a random cadet can grab 4 from the vendor, this makes no sense, why do cadets get access to a flash-bang but not a pepper spray is beyond me.

And currently, thanks to flash-bangs there is zero reason for using teargas grenades, thanks to flash-bangs being in every officers security belt there are zero barfights, thanks to flash-bangs there is no reason to hold a hostage as a common security officer can drop you on his random ass patrol through the station.

"But they're tactical, and security is trained in tactical combat"

Exactly, there is a place for tactical things, the armory.

"But you can throw them back"

The timer can be set to a single second or instant explosion so you have no chance.

"But they can blow up in their hand"

Yes and they can also click on themselves with a gun, this is not a weakness, this is a weakness of the player not the flashbang, we don't say LWAP's are weak because a player can't aim.

"But they aren't useful all the time"

They are useful in crowd situations, in breaching situations (where they are supposed to be used), in single armed target situations, in hostage situations and blob which their tear apart.

Now there are a few situations where flashbangs are not good.

Target has a hardsuit/voidsuit helmet. (Flash, Pepper spray, Teargas grenades also become useless)

Target is an IPC. (Flash, Taser, Baton, Pepper spray, Teargas grenade, Rubbers also become useless)

Target is too close to you. (Teargas grenades, Taser also become useless)

You can't throw inside the room without getting yourself killed. (All methods become useless)

Now I don't want the flash-bang completely removed, I simply think that there is no reason for a private patrolling officer to have a flash-bang on him at all times, if they face a tactical situation they go to the armory to arm up, that's why the flash-bangs should be there.

Call this salt, you most likely will, but deep down in your heart you know the only reason you want to keep your flash-bangs is because they make plenty of situations a matter of two clicks instead of actually having to form a plan.

[Fiskap]

This does make sense, I support it. An officer shouldn't be carrying that much gear during code green with no major incidents.

[Fire and Glory]

I do support this, if security feels like they need might need to flashbang and eliminate then they can get them from the armoury along with all the other stuff like riot armor.

[Dragonspare]

I support this, flashbangs ten to solve situations too easily, i have sinned in that regard myself once, i consider flashbangs as a piece of MAJOR equipment, it being too dangerous, seeing how much damage you can do when the others are flashed

[sonicgotnuked]

Yeahh, we rarely have hostage situations because security just cooks a flash bang in their hand and throws it at the person before they can react and knock them down. I support this.

[Arrow768]

Sadly the above statement is completely true.

Just a day ago we had a hostage situation in medbay where a nursing intern with a taser and a knive took a doctor hostage.

Security heard the shots of the taser and was quickly at the scene.

The officer just threw a flashbang and the hostage situation "has been dealt with"

Well, the hostage died in the process and could not be cloned because cloning was not functional at the time.

So yes, lets move flashbangs and gas grenades to the armory.

I would even support changing the access on the "public" armory to access_armory so officers have to go through the warden or hos if they want something from there.

But that is something for a different discussion.

[Snoopy11]

I support moving the flashbangs to the armory, but I do not support Arrow's public armory access change suggestion.

[Mofo1995]

I agree completely. This has happened to me every single time I've taken a hostage in the past 6 months. Every time it's just: Flashbang, boom, cuffs, 'say ":s We have the terrorist in custody." 'Though, correction, sometimes they'll throw flashbangs when I'm properly protected and just bluntly get the hostage killed leading directly into a shootout. Because once that flashbang is in, they're rushing no matter what the result of the banger to root, toot, and shoot. It's sloppy, often ends up getting the hostage hurt or killed in retaliation, and instantly diffuses every hostage situation and ends many antag rounds with no fanfare. Flashbangs are not standard equipment for officers, both private and public, and every officer shouldn't just have them on hand. They should be reserved for special situations just like all the riot equipment, more serious armor, and more serious weaponry.

Additionally, do flashbangs still dispense form the security vendors? If this change were made, those would have to be moved as well. Perhaps an extra box in the armory and removing them from the machine.

EDIT: I always ahelp when they do this so callously and wrecklessly, because it does almost always end up in me harming/killing the hostage. If flashbangs were moved to the armory, it would force security personnel to consider and plan each situation rather than just bang-rushing, which is my primary complaint about these situations. In my opinion, it would legitimize flashbang usage in hostage situations because the barrier for entry is increased, meaning officers had to regroup, discuss, and plan in order to effect their plan. In other words, I think this would be better for security as well as for antags, since it would make the case for accusations of hostage situation rushing more difficult to make, since they would have to go through actual effort to have the equipment on hand to go through with their hostage rescue plans. Everyone wins and there's less headaches/room for sHitlery.

[Faris]

While I simply love flash bangs and actually empty the box throughout my kit, I still think it should be more restricted.

[Arrow768]

Will be changed in a upcoming update