Kaed

It would be kind of interesting to have a way to set what your help intent interaction was from a list of options (hug, pat, handshake, etc) instead of defaulting to a hug.

When I spoke of objective unfairness, I was drawing attention to the fact that you can't judge something is unfair if you can't see what was actually selected, primarily because of your claim that my system was unfair due to giving a 5% chance that a something the other 95% didn't want. Objective fairness not existing is largely irrelevant in comparison to the perception of what is fair and not fair, and citing it as a reason why a majority system works is nonsensical. This argument basically boils down to "nothing is fair, therefore my unfair idea works better than yours because I want it and it's easier to keep it." A person can't claim what went on behind a curtain is unfair to them because they don't know what actually happened. It doesn't matter, practically speaking, if only 5% of the people voting picked the result that occurred, when there was a 30% chance that a differently-weighted revote would occur because of the people that selected Random. The only thing the players actually see is what the round ends up becoming, and their vote only counted for a 1:[voters] chance that they would get what they wanted, anyway. Objective fairness might not actually exist, but we can simulate it a lot closer than we do with straight majority voting. This argument can keep going for ages until we both look like prats, Scheveningen. Maybe letting it go so other people can weigh in would be a good idea?

No I didn't, really. Only one thing can be picked in any deterministic outcome, yes, but you don't have to see what the outcome is in this scenario, nor does there have to be an outcome where get something (antagonists) so you can do things that make it more fair for everyone. A majority ruling does not make something more valid than other choices. It just means that more people wanted that thing. When you have a situation where something has to be specifically picked and you can't select 'random' or 'nothing', then you have to use majority. But not here.

This is not a political election, though. This is determining the round type in a video game. You can't make the comparison because they aren't an analogue of each other. We don't vote for 'no president' or 'pick a random president but don't tell us which which one it is until they step out onto the podium, and maybe it was no president after all, so just sit there and wait hopefully for a present to come out' like we do here with antagonists. Majority is important in a political election because only a single individual can be picked, you can't create situations where any other outcome happens, and you can't hide who the present is because it's important that the candidate is identifiable at the end of the voting. There is no reason why in this situation one vote should be more meaningful than another, other than because you are attributing it to be the same as a political election and it works that way there.

It would change something, though. Because at least you would know your vote, whatever it was, was considered by the voting system, regardless of what the actual result is. A 5% chance of getting what you wanted is still better than 0%.

Except that the antagonist game mode would already be concealed from them in this proposed system, and they wouldn't even know if their antag vote got picked. There's actually no way to know if your vote for Malfunction is what got the round type what it is, or if it was selected due to the people who voted Random (and those votes will happen, regardless). This concept of objective unfairness doesn't actually exist, Scheveningen. People have to perceive the result of a random selection for them to feel they were cheated by dice, because injustice doesn't exist unless someone imagines it is there. There is nothing to complain about when you can't observe what choice was selected outside of Extended, which remains a transparent round type because it only attracts people specifically interested in no antagonists, beyond the usual complaints about not liking the specific antagonist round type, which already occur in any game mode outside of extended. What the entire voting system really boils down to is 'antags or not', regardless of how many different options there are to vote for. That already exists in the situation we have now, it's just a busted system where a single majority makes all the choices because making other choices is irrelevant. What your proposed scenario of 100 votes would actually look like in the current system would be 30 votes for extended, and 70 votes for secret (give or take the couple outliers who pointlessly vote for a specific round type), making secret win. At least my system is giving is a the 30 people voting extended a partial chance that it happens. You know, much like there is a partial chance that extended happens in what is currently called Secret.

On the contrary, it's much more fair for everyone who votes than a strict majority system. The reason why majority votes happen so strongly right now between extended and secret is because of the knowledge that not voting for it is essentially wasting your vote. In your situation where Malfunction is selected from that hypothetical pool, it happened with a 1:20 probability, which was basically just lucky for the 5 people who voted malfunction. There was another 6:20 probability that Extended could have happened, but it didn't. The system that we have right now takes makes the other 70% of players in this scenario basically each shit and waste their votes, which is not fair to them. Statistically speaking, 30% of people wanting extended does not mean that it is a real majority, the calculation is just being muddled up by there being 10+ other variables throwing off the majority in the 'do we want antags or not' binary state. You're not taking agency away from the players, you are placing equal agency for everyone to have a round selected by a neutral judge. You act like rolling a die is somehow making the die steal your choice away, when the current system throws any choice that isn't Secret or Extended is already throwing that choice in the garbage in 95% of round starts. That system is really what is stealing your choice away, not a random number generator.

I have to admit I much prefer the stank method to catching a disease off of a corpse. Perhaps you could accrue nausea by being in the area with a rotting corpse, and eventually start throwing up if you stay there. The ability to detect corpses by their smell would also be really useful. I'm not sure how viable that would be to implement, though.

... I'm not asking anything to be removed from secret, I'm actually asking for everything but a straight extended vote to fall under 'secret'. Extended along with all of the rest of the game modes will still exist if someone selects 'random' or if they select 'extended'. I don't really get your problem here. This isn't a clone of the last few threads, and isn't accomplishing the same objective at all. Look, if five people are voting, 1 person votes extended, 1 person votes Crossfire, and 3 people vote Random, then you have a 20% chance of the round being either extended or crossfire each, and then 60% chance that a random round is selected from all valid round types. You just don't get to SEE the result as anything but secret, unless Extended is rolled outside of Random.

To be honest I only posted this suggestion because of another recent suggestion whining about extended being in the secret rotation. But the voting system we have right now is hard majority and inherently flawed by the bias that causes, and there is almost 0 purpose in voting anything except extended or secret, except in the very specific situation where someone manages to entice everyone to vote for a specific round type via OOC. I don't honestly see how providing people with Actual Secret and giving non-Secret (random) votes some actual power would be met with whining. This has zero bearing on the actual suggestion, surprisingly enough! Give it another read and perhaps consider it more carefully. All this does is give non-Secret votes some actual power while preserving the Secret status we already have by dint of it being the only round type ever reliably picked if it isn't a voted Extended. There is a world of difference between "maybe there is antags this round" and "there are vampires this round because it's a Vampire round"

I'll make this short, it's conceptually simple, even if I don't know how it would be coded. -Replace the majority vote system with a weighed chance by votes system, where every vote provides an actual chance for your vote to occur -Replace 'Secret' with 'Random' -Make every round start display as 'Secret', even if it started as a specific round type due to a vote, unless it's a vote-resulting Extended, at which point it displays as Extended. This way, everything isn't just piled on secret because there is no other viable choice except extended and voting for anything else isn't a waste anymore. And you can't metagame the round because it's always hidden unless it's a voted Extended.

Pull request here https://github.com/Aurorastation/Aurora.3/pull/4425 I have started work on adding a tea system to the game. Here is a broad summary of the features that will be added. Feedback and thoughts are appreciated. Basic Tea Changes: All tea currently in the game will be replaced with Artificial Tea, which will be severely limited in it's medicinal qualities, if it has any at all. This stuff is basically artificial flavor tea and syrup like you would find in a fast food drink dispenser alongside the soda pop. It will otherwise be the same as it was before for all current drink recipes. New Plants: Hydroponics will receive several new plants related to making tea. This will include the tea bush, along with several other herbs and spices, such as spearmint, peppermint, cinnamon, and cardamon. These plants are not currently planned to be available in the basic hydroponics vendor, but rather will all be available in a boxed 'Tea Starter Kit' which can be purchased from cargo, and it will include one seed pouch for each new plant. These plants can be harvested multiple times, similar to chili and fruit trees. I currently have no plants to involve the xenobotany system in this, and the plants will not mutate (if it's even possible to make that not happen) New Machine: Teamatic This machine will have two settings: Process and Blend. When in the Process setting, takes certain items from the tea system (probably only one kind of item at a time), and from that item you can get 1 more more processed items. For instance, tea leaves can be used to make black, white, or green tea, possibly other things. Oranges can be used to make dried orange rinds or orange oil. These various items will be items in their own right, not reagents (orange oil, for instance, will be a small vial or capsule full of light yellow orange oil), and will all take up a negligible amount of space, like a piece of paper. I might implement some kind of plant bag for teas, or let you put tea items in a plant bag, if it becomes a problem. While in the Blend setting, you will take multiple items similar to cooking recipes, and if they are a valid recipe, it will create a tea bag of the type of tea you have made. New Machines: Kettle and Hotpad The kettle and hotpad/stove are separate items. The kettle holds water and tea bags, and the process goes like this. -Fill the kettle with water -Put the kettle on the stove -Wait until the kettle whistles -Put the teabag(s) into the kettle -Wait for the brewing to finish -Pour your delicious tea into a glass Part of this process involves creating a new reagent: Hot Water. This is a special subtype of Water, and it has a limited lifespan, which is probably going to be something like 5-10 minutes. If it is not used to make tea in this time, it reverts to regular water and must be heated again. For employee safety and prevention of burned fingers (and simplicity's sake/sanity in coding), the stove 's heating cycle will only function if a kettle of non-hot water is placed on it - you cannot use the stove to keep the water hot indefinitely. Hot water can also be splashed on someone to inflict moderately serious burns if you are some kind of psycho. New Drinks: Teas The final result of this will be a number of different tea variants, some of which will be easy to make and cosmetic, others will involve some more difficulty in creating but will have mild to moderate healing properties. I have plans to use the two tajaran healing plants in teas to utilize and enhance their special reagent properties, among some other things. There will be a few special offensive teas, such as sleepy tea and poison tea, and a few possibly secret tea recipes that involve processing rare/round specific ingredients like carpotoxin, ectoplasm, or merlin's tears. I have vague plans for the ultimate form of tea healing all 3 types of damage and even allowing limited repair of organ damage, like peridaxon (but probably only if it's below a certain threshold like 5-10) I think the basic, cosmetic teas that have little or no healing properties will be purchasable via cargo in a pack that gives you like 6 tea bags of that variety, for people who don't want to deal with all this and just want to roleplay drinking tea.

The smells system seems interesting, though the idea of a disease from touching a rotting dead body also seems kind of intriguing. Citing 'realism' as the primary disqualifier for a mechanic should not be a thing, this mechanic was intended to give some kind of penalty for leaving a dead body lying around to rot. Everything related to medicine and health happens in the round at an accelerated rate from 'real life' already, from wound mending to surgery and chemistry.'

Everyone complains about the unrealism of things like this and that no one would take heart damage that fast, but they are okay with applying a gauze and a bandaid curing your huge gaping arm wound in the span of 5 minutes, or the surgery for organ repair taking less than 5 minutes. Just eat something besides junk food from the vending machines. This feature was added, I'm pretty sure, so people would have more reason to visit the kitchen instead of just relying on vending machines all shift. Deal with it.

Did you know?? -You can silence a wizard with an obsidian item by using, preventing them from casting spells temporarily -There are mechanics in place for organ transplants, allowing you to replace people's vital organs, if you know what you are doing -You can eat soup with a fork Wow, mister Kaed! I only knew some of those things, probably! But what do any of those have to do with each other? Well, little Urist, I'll tell you. All three of these mechanics have almost no practical use in regular gameplay! That's right, their existence is so irrelevant that even the people that do know they exist have probably never used them more than once, if ever, and even then, it accomplished nothing that could not have been resolved more easily with another method! Gosh, mister Kaed! It sounds like you think this thread is pointless and you're implying that adding an organ donation tag to people's IDs would be an utter waste of time! That sounds pretty mean! What could it hurt to add it, it's completely harmless! Well, little Urist. You're right about at least one of those things!

I think I'll do that two base game tea instead of removing it's healing entirely

I actually had never heard of such a thing until just now but it makes a lot of sense and solves the problem! Maybe I'll put a battery in the kettle that can be taken out and recharged, or replaced with a better battery..

This is Future Tea. Duke Purple is a GMO that is laced with antitoxins that make it a mass producible, weaker version of dyvolene. There you go, there's your explanation. /thread In all seriousness, I have in plans right now to redo the entirety of of tea with an update, and this is a good time to bring it up. I will run through some of the ideas I have in place for it, and you tell me if you like them. -All tea currently in game (vender and dispenser teas) is going to be replaced with generic Duke Purple 'Artificial Tea', which is basically 'tea' as much as the syrupy stuff you get from fast food fountains. This will still function for the purpose of drinks and stuff that require tea, but it will lose it's medicinal properties. -A number of tea (and mint, perhaps) related plant variants will be added to the hydroponics system. I'm not sure yet if these will be shoved in with the other seeds (I don't like this one), dispensed from a special Tea Seeds Machine, or ordered from cargo as seed boxes like 2-3 seed pouches each. -Teas are grown like other plants, but when you harvest it, you don't eat it straight, because it has no significant nutritional value. Instead, you dry the tea using that drying machine (I will add one to hydroponics maybe, since it seems to be missing one?). This will come up later -The kitchen will gain a special item, a kettle, which can be picked up and filled with water, and then... I guess microwaved, because we don't have anything resembling a stove right now, and it's the only thing that makes moderate sense. (Might have to add a counter top stove or something...) Anyway, the kettle turns water into Hot Water, when properly utilized (which also will eventually turn back into regular water if left sitting too long). -The assorted dried tea/mint plants are either ground up and mixed together into blends, or just placed whole into the kettle to create various kinds of teas, a process which requires a wait time for the tea to steep before being poured out as a tasty drink. These teas will have various (mild) medicinal or buffing qualities, one of which will be curing toxins, but there will be other stuff, too. Still mentally spitballing all this.

This again can't re just remove the entire inane event please it doesn't even contribute a temporary sense of danger or excitement or interest like the other ones. it's just stupid and kind of annoying, and gets ignored.

I'll see if I can poke around at making footwraps silent. I don't honestly care about these silly ideas of footstep noise being a vital part of 'game balance'. The only time it is really relevant is in a few very specific circumstances (none of which involve foot wraps), and the rest of the time, everyone just ignores the sounds of shoes clopping around as background noise on the station.

I'm dying inside

Then this thread should not be a problem for you, should it?

You aren't understanding the situation that I am trying to prevent, clearly, so I will explain it again. This is not about captains giving orders or interfering with the ERT. I never asked for or expected for captains to have authority over emergency response duties. This is about the ERT removing the captain and other command staff members from their position, without reason, so they sit in a back room of the bridge or the bar for the rest of the round, not performing their duties or assisting the crew in any way, presumably so the ERT members can feel like the biggest kids on the playground and stroke their egos.

That sounds pretty reasonable, Synnono. They should only have total authority in situations relevant to the emergency they are resolving. The private security may stand down, but police are not allowed to relieve the manager/supervisor on location of duty for no reason any more than than can summarily arrest someone on no charges. That's ridiculous abuse of exceeding authority.

Good lord man, what is this drama you are unloading on us. Outside the station hierarchy does not mean above it, and there is absolutely no reason that the ERT need the authority of supreme operational power. The hypothetical captain you speak of calls an ERT to solve a problem that they feel cannot be resolved by the internal crew he has, but he's still in charge of his own vessel. There's no logical reason for the company hiring them to put more authority and trust in a bunch of gun toting mercenaries than the person they selected to oversee the functions of their entire research station. Their function is even described in their name - they are being called to respond to an emergency. Unless the captain is part of, or the cause of, the emergency they have been called to resolve, there is no reason they should be able to depose his authority on a passing whim. And speaking from an out of character perspective, I once again reiterate that most ERT are composed at least partially of salty ghosts who died in-round, and have a personal beef with the antagonists they are going to fight. They are just a bunch of armed muscle, and their judgement is likely already compromised because of their previous failure to win against the antagonists. They don't really deserve the right to be treated like the Voice of Nanotrasen Executives just for clicking the 'join ERT' button, or given the power to overrule the person in charge of the station, unless said captain is somehow a danger to the station themselves. Calling an emergency response team is literally just calling for backup guns when you're out of options, there's no implied turning over of operational authority attached to it. Dismissing the captain from duty for literally no reason other than powerboner or giggles is incredibly stupid and should not be permitted, because it's not doing anything to resolve the problem. No person in the game has no strings attached ultimate authority, not even the captain himself, who has to answer to CCIA if his conduct results in an IR. Don't give it to a disposable character whose personality and motivation can be summed up as 'validhunter'