Scheveningen

You neglected to mention that the same PR also adds gun dual wielding, which is not really insignificant. https://github.com/Aurorastation/Aurora.3/pull/5071 A more interesting curveball being thrown to mirror gun accuracy is fine. Dual-wielding will be intensely abused by security and antagonists to alike to gank even faster. Dual-wielding revolvers (regardless of the other individual nerf you'd apply) would be much more powerful than just having double the capacity. Also consider dual sawed-off shotguns, heisters can acquire them and then steal the bar shotgun, or one can be lucky enough for the merchant to acquire lots of contraband. At its most ideal range for revolvers (that being within 4-5 tiles), the proposed graphic has at least 80% accuracy for each individual shot. For shotguns this is marginally less so. You can cut this down by 20% and you still invite the possibility of 2-shotting someone in the face as their head falls off. Characterized by my flash PR, I don't think a singular feature should remain in the game that could effectively ruin someone's round instantly short of a bomb, the only exception in which it makes sense. Let's not become Colonial Marines with the dual-wielding. I don't mind that there's an accuracy penalty but it will only invite the stereotype of caveman-brained security officers that run into a fight with two laser rifles, carbines, or pistols, whatever-- to heavily suppress a single antagonist to death. Nobody would enjoy the opposite either. You can't moderate this either, because they're using a feature that exists in the game to be used for the intended purpose that it is. How does one powergame if they're using a feature as it was intended to be used? It's like yelling an admin to ban the Master Chief because he'd magdump Covenant scrubs with dual SMGs. What the heck is he supposed to do, use the plas-pistol and a covenant carbine all the time? Jeez. When faced with the, "have one gun that is pretty okay" or "dual wield two of the same gun to deal double damage in the same time", it will be a no-brainer for the aspiring powergamer that wishes to ruin the round of the average antagonist. Let alone what antagonists will do, god forbid. If you didn't think being ganked with a revolver was any fun, how about being gunned down by the guy with dual SMGs, revolvers, carbines, et cetera? Everything else is fine, though I think the sniper rifle should be moved further down this graphic: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Kf1R2cqH8w3S8Gt9-Uyk-seQ2t_9up4JVZ3d7bO5eqA/edit#gid=0 Because sniper rifles would bring back a monstrous comeback that would make them the superior weapon, as they all deal heavy amounts of damage with the cost of the accuracy system being mildly inconsistent. If you never used a LWAP before, it's really disgusting to use if you hit all four shots.

Add the captain formal uniform to the loadout pls.

Never fix what isn't broken. Every time these discussions comes up, it's always playing the blame game and not realizing that there are genuine human beings behind each side of the discussion. When someone tries to remind the ALL-POWERFUL VOCAL MINORITY GENERAL CONSENSUS that the situation is never as simple as they are quick to strawman something as, guess what the vocal minority does? They bitch and whine and complain about how absolutely oppressed they are within the community and act like the responses to their shenaniganry is equivalent to ideological genocide and being silenced. I've been in this community for about four years now and I still haven't seen a single person come up with a Community Cure-All to fix the quality of roleplay on the server. It will never happen. Ever since this server started, nobody on any other server has figured out how to deal with any other issue that happens in SS13 such as shitcurity, bad antags who waste the slot and other people's time, and whatever inane arguments are repeated over, and over, and over again. Security will always be reinforced by newer, inexperienced players that don't know the first thing about ethically utilizing authority to do their job properly. People will cry about it, security players get pressured to leave the server because of the toxicity. Antagonists will always be reinforced by newer, inexperienced players that don't know the first thing about reasonable escalation and properly managing to write a decent story while robusting people in fun and interesting ways. People will cry about it if antag players dare try to add consequence to other players that try to oppose them. Antag players get pressured to leave the server because of the toxicity. Gee, maybe the problem with the community is that it's filled with equally toxic, selfish individuals who only look out for and think of #1. Which includes almost everyone, and I speak from experience here, because I've met very few people on this server that I could honestly say I'd sacrifice my own time and enjoyment for just to ensure they were having fun. Most of those people that I once would've thought that I could've given my time and energy for, are gone. At the end of the day, people play this server for their own reasons. If you honestly think people don't OOCly look out for themselves in a game that rewards you for playing selfishly and punishes you for taking your time, then you're dealing with a delusion. This game is cruel and unforgiving. Why should the community be any different?

this seems cool

BYOND Key: Scheveningen Staff BYOND Key: [mention]JMJ_99[/mention] Game ID: on discord Reason for complaint: because I do care Evidence/logs/etc:. . Additional remarks: save this boy

Why would that make any sense, and why would it matter either way? The gas filters that are intended to be set for phoron help the engine not delaminate anyway. If it's set to phoron-phoron like it should be, everything that isn't phoron gets slowly filtered out of the supermatter chamber. yet another artificial difficulty suggestion wtf

:thinking: Well, despite the different atmosphere in which I'm comparing us to, Bay has done this. It went okay. The loss endured is that no one can play AI anymore.

Here's the thing. The consequence already happened. It was IC. Kalren is slated to be a ro-butt soon. No need to double down when the dealer shows a 6 and you already have 18.

Amazingly, having your station attacked by terrorists and having the entire establishment put on lockdown for the rest of the shift is not supposed to be fun for civilians. It is only a focus on the antagonists and security. No one else gets to have fun in the round. Both antagonists and security have only one goal and that's to kill other characters in the round. Good luck figuring out how to stop that.

The reasons for this existing in the first place is due to the heavily ingrained rule of the server that pretty much dictates that your character shouldn't be actively doing things or being in certain situations that they know unnecessarily endangers them. This applies to everyone except security. Why? Because security is realistically expected to die in order to get rid of a particularly hostile threat if that is what it takes, from a NanoTrasen point of view. From the security point of view, they're trying to protect people. Even from themselves. If people don't like this, this can change, of course. No longer does security need to really put such a heavy priority on the safety of those without special rank. If we want to really start roleplaying an insidiously corrupt corporation that has a command staff culture that views many of their assets inherently disposable (because that's what the corporation would be trying to silently promote), then that is totally something I'd be onboard with. I will have to retire two characters because of it, but it doesn't really matter to anyone else.

The problem with AIs in general is that they are tucked incredibly neatly into their own impenetrable autism bunkers which is mostly indestructible to individual infiltration. It is absolutely impossible to get inside the AI upload without the AI turning on the turrets behind you. An interesting solution to this would be to disable the AI from being able to toggle their outer turrets whatsoever similar to how the telecommunications has a lockdown, provided said AI is a non-antagonist. If the AI is an antagonist in any way, they are able to override this. This permits solo traitors to be able to effectively walk into the AI core with an emag and hack the AI by themselves.

Lame idea. AI players need to have their behavior better moderated, not punished through mechanics.

Yes, okay.

that's fine

I think a few things need to be taken into consideration. [*]Some characters speak stiffly on purpose. Not all human beings are bundles of unbridled energy. Their coldness often speaks platitudes on who they are as a person and why they conduct themselves in that way, which is often a subtle layer of depth by itself. You don't usually look at it that way, but once it occurs to you, you realize how much it says about that character. It's extremely easy to be a critic about less emotional characters. [*]Whether a character decides to be grammatically correct or not is based on their background and whether they deem it appropriate. A person that's grammatically correct is often one that has deep respect for language conventions and takes speaking a language very seriously. A person who isn't grammatically correct is better characterized as more of a free spirit that shows off their nonchalant nature and raw emotion whenever they can, just because. [*]The point about cultural homogenization on Earth is not true. While some of the same nations surely don't exist in some capacity anymore, Earth is still a rather diverse division of various cultures, races and beliefs when it comes to the people that live on it. Sol Common may still be the nationalized language, but there are thousands of dialects all across Earth, such as there's various dialects in Tau Ceti, or Adhomai, so on. The manner in which one speaks their mind depends on where they come from and how they speak it.

Probably in cases where they're leaking corporate secrets, in which the information needs to be D-noticed right away to reduce the damage.

Sure, let's go for round two, because the first time really worked out for the both of us. Lemme put my thoughts on how I've behaved, though: I believe I was justified in saying the recent things lately because I genuinely think you're an intolerant and malicious person, and tolerating intolerance is not something I tolerate or care to uphold. You've demonstrated numerous times that you -- actually, hang on, Zelmana said it the absolute best in politicla thunderdome. I hope he gets a pat on the damn back for this. . ^ THIS, TBH, FAM. This represents one half of what I know about you. Other people I know generally are divided into more parts than this about what I find characteristic and unique to them. The only two things I find unique and significant to you are two things: 1.) You're great at insulting people and baiting people into arguments, 2.) In any form of discussion you always seek to 'win' the discussion, no matter the cost. You are ALWAYS right and everyone else is ALWAYS wrong. the irony of this statement, seeing as you pretty much do the same thing regardless about other people. It's the drama section of that discord, it is exactly what it is meant for. Blame [mention]Lohikar[/mention] for setting up a space for that. Apparently not, because you inferred I was both a downie and an N word to defend yourself rather than just picking the proper route and going, "You're right, I'm sorry" without the additional baggage you constantly sling on your statements directed at me, because it's evidently obvious you enjoy frustrating me, otherwise you wouldn't be doing it. You clearly didn't value your staff position enough to not act like you did, otherwise we wouldn't be at this stage where you're attempting to seek punishment on me for something you did far more wrong than I did. I'll ask other staff members whether being vocal about a very unfit staff member is against the rules and "harassment" now. All things considered, aren't you the hypocrite for accusing other people of harassment, seeing as how you pretty much inferred to me... ..That, because, what the fuck is wrong with you? From what I can pretty much guess based on how I've seen you treat me and others: You're either inept in regards to social conventions (making you really unqualified for staff) or you're a toxic, unrepentant asshole that only cares to apologize for their toxicity when there's consequences if you won't apologize (making you unqualified for this community). There's not really a thing in the middle here because I can't recall a single situation where you were remotely attempting to be nice to me. Even in the more calm period we both had after the first complaint, you were still acting incredibly suspicious, dismissive and low-key disrespectful towards me. Whether the suspicion is justified or not, it doesn't matter, because it's still proof you had very, very little respect for me. This escalated over time and now we're here. No, you haven't apologized in a direct, singular capacity towards me. You're flat out not telling the truth when you say you've sincerely apologized. This entire sentence makes no sense and I have no idea what you're talking about in regards to a "semi-private environment." It's a public community. Anyone can join. Whether they stay is a different story. Funny enough, I spoke to the other head admin about whether you'd get punishment for your conduct in discord, since you left staff long before official discipline could be issued. . Are you familiar with the concept of 'crying Wolf?' While not 100% am I attempting to draw comparisons between that fable and your situation, I'm effectively saying the moral of the story here is that staff will judge the validity of a complaint based on the person issuing it. Similar concept, they probably don't just want to avoid dealing with me, they want nothing to do with you either, because your credibility lately is nil. Funny, it is almost as if what I said in #trashcan earlier this week has some truth to it. Take Garn's "I don't want to do work, leave me alone curls up in shell" statement: If he insists I block you or else I get a week-long ban, then I'll abide that and never talk to the OP over the public discord ever again. I imagine it doesn't bar me from replying to this forum post, if it does, oh well, I'll chance that risk for the sake of clarity. If I get slapped with a week long ban as a result of this post, I'm going to make an alt and post the Charlie Sheen "I don't know what I expected" meme in the off-topic board. /s Looking at his statement pretty much infers he already made up his mind about this entire situation and also pretty intent on doling out punishment already. Because he's one of two head administrators that's insisted the only recourse is to bury this issue until it rises up again. If both of the chief representatives of the administrative team have mostly been reticent about addressing this issue beyond what they've said already, it goes to show how much they want to bury this issue and move on. They don't want to deal with this. This pretty much means the only way this gets resolved in a way you like is that you speak to me through DMs to get all of this sorted and out of the way. Just a suggestion, though, I'd hazard a guess you have no intention in attempting to bury the hatchet for part 2 because you don't trust me. There's nothing I can say to get you to trust me. I don't care if you choose not to talk to me again. That's all I have to say. If Burger's response is not ideal, consider this post as the only one on this thread.

6 SHOTS MORE THAN ENOUGH TO KILL ANYTHING THAT MOVES please god, yes.

Also do note that the hostage only really matters if they're critical to the station's operation. And if you're capable of making them permanently dead. Security will take silly risks if you decided it was a good idea to kidnap a janitor. They won't if it's for the captain, they'll have to play much smarter than you are in order to do that. Hostages don't make you invulnerable. The act of deterrence just makes you harder to touch without consequences, though.

I don't really want to go into an in-depth argument about this, as it'd be a bit thread-hijacky. As such, I'll just note that I play more shifts where the kitchen isn't productive than shifts where it is (My common playtime being 8 PM - 4 AM (CDT)) and point out that that was only one - and I'd even go as far as to say the smallest - of several points leveled against this being a mechanic. How would you feel about persistent flavor messages about how uncomfortable you are, if no mechanical punishment? It's a great idea. Issue is with hardsuits and voidsuits, if you stay in them for too long, your character starts to overheat and it has really nasty consequences if you get way too hot. So this is kinda already supported by mechanics but it's not really much of an issue since people pay attention to their temperature gauge and take off the suits after awhile. So basically they mechanically work around it so that they don't have to face the consequences of it. Which is roleplay, I guess? My legs are OK

P-Dox. Holy shit, I'm using that now. P-Dox does tend to err on the side of being the inner rebel we all wish we had the confidence to be in terms of roleplaying characters of that caliber (he actually taught me a way to escape isolation, like holy shit, I had no idea it was fucking possible and it changes everything about security). This is a fine character though, he DM'd me the text for review and I honestly thought it was pretty good. #reformed ATLAS member? That sounds interesting enough to me, especially since Flavius apparently joined ATLAS in the first place for an understandably personal reason. I'm confident P-Dox will do well as a head of staff. If you can't beat them, join them.

Now we need New Mombasa as an obligatory Halo reference. Jokes aside, though. This concept really has me interested. A conversion antag that I'd want to support, for once. Amazing. MIZZ Naval Intelligence. So check your mouths, find your chairs… …and get set for a combat drop! This is an entertaining idea. Abductors are great stuff on the other servers that have them and I think HRP could definitely benefit from it. With some clear changes, of course.

[mention]Sharp[/mention] is drafting a disabilities/ableism policy for hiring. According to him it didn't go through as policy when it was initially addressed awhile back due to the contentiousness of it but I imagine when he has time to revisit the topic he'll present the newer and improved policy for these kinds of characters. Since something like this is already in the works I'd suggest waiting until Abosh has something to say about it.

Gee, I wonder why that is. . It's almost like nobody can trust you to be civil because you prove time and time again how much of a toxic and inflammatory person you are. You make actually approaching you in DMs an extremely unattractive option because of how toxic you are publicly.

:ok_hand: those pink haired medical doctors are too curvy for me :weary: