BurgerBB

No policy, feature, or anything for that matter will do anything to solve the problem of discord toxicity. If a new policy is implemented, it will be ignored like the "Don't be a dick rule." currently is. If a new report system is implemented, it will be ignored like how some toxic banter on the actual server in OOC will be ignored as just "banter". If you want to see change on the server, kick up a fucking storm every time someone is dick via the official means. If you see someone who's an absolute fucking shitlord, make a player complaint. Post the proof. So far any time anyone is toxic on discord, it is largely ignored by those subject to the toxicity and those witnessing it. There is a serious normalization of bad behavior on discord and most people are fine with that, including staff. I recall an instance where a previous head admin was trying to get someone to calm down, and despite them insulting me twice after telling them to stop, nothing was done past that. I've been a dick on discord in the past, quite frequently before I became a dev. Despite all my toxic behavior on discord then, I've received 0 player complaints and I think 1 discord warning which expired in about a week. Honestly, when people are toxic, the only people who give a shit are the victims of the toxicity. This needs to change.

Then it seems like this player complaint will never be resolved if you don't take responsibility for your behavior. I absolutely guarantee you that if you were a player without any staff position you would've been gone. You unironically called me retarded. You've unironically repeated multiple times that you hate me and wished me gone in ways that did not warrant the response. You've unironically lamented that I'm not banned yet multiple times. You have a tendency to group anyone you don't like into one category and apply the same bans for them. You had a breakdown over me saying that I thought your character was a joke character. You've stated that I'm a constant complainer and use this VERY FREQUENTLY to dismiss any issues I bring up. So let me repeat this. I stated that your character wasn't a very good character, and very calmly without using any personal attacks or other garbage, stated several very valid reasons why. You, in response, decided that it would be a good idea to immediately throw personal attacks, call me retarded, an annoying shitwad, and other garbage such as lamenting that I'm not banned yet. When I properly made a complaint about this, you justified this by saying you get mad when everyone else points out you play a character and that you really like your character. You are a head administrator. I've seen people get permabanned for less on the server. I, myself, have received warnings in game for being rude. I have received a forum warning for being too aggressive sometimes, but not insulting people. This should honestly be a staff complaint, but it was moved into a player complaint. I have very little issue with how you play Butterfill compared to the issue of how you behave yourself.

False. I believe the only time I've said anything similar to this is a joke about the futility of expecting more than policy changes when making two staff complaints against headdevs. So have I. I believe I put in considerable work into the server in terms of PRs. I think at some points I would spend 4 hours a day making PRs that would go to the server, only to really get insults and other bullshit thrown my way. I believe I attempted to discuss this with you and your responses have mostly been: "okay" "not my problem" "whatever" I admit you've probably put in more work than me in total but honestly I have absolutely minimal sympathy for you regarding this. I do not shit on you AT ALL and I believe that this is probably the only instance where I ever "shat" on you, and that's me saying "Your character is meme and here is a valid explanation why." which is absolutely nothing compared to what other users say about other people's characters. I do not endorse what Sheveningen says and honestly I'm a little annoyed that you're grouping me with him again despite our response to this situation being VERY different. Because at least with Butterfill, you play an odd character that can easily be mistaken as a greytide or a new player. Like I honestly don't know how you cannot understand that a janitor who is bald, types in lowercase, says some really fucking weird shit over comms, and does some really weird shit ICly isn't going to get a few weird looks. Hell, the only reason why I know your character is because I recall that you were doing some weird things and I managed to, without any external help or assistance, determine that it was a regular playing Butterfill. After some critical thinking I realised that you were the own who plays Butterfill since he only appears when you talk in OOC and it seems like something you would do. Also welcome to the club. I get recognized all the time and people have treated me differently because of it. Before I was developer, absolutely everyone and their dog would roleplay with my characters and enjoy it. Now? Absolutely no one. Menown I think is the only one who actually initiates anything anymore with my characters. I have walked passed characters that I've had tons of friendly interactions with in the past, and they don't even say hi anymore. This is something I can't reasonably control anymore so it's not worth complaining about. Character recognition happens to everyone and people metagrudge for it. I also had to retire a character (Ilaeza Marwani) because I was unironically kicked out of the lizard clique as not a single unathi player, except for loredevs and other staff, would interact with me. At this point I just embrace it in an attempt to prove people wrong about their misconceptions. I'm not saying I'm the victim here, I'm just saying that this is a common problem and not exclusive to anymore. Honestly, at this point, make a new character. I know it's not that simple but it you're being genuine in saying that you're not playing him as a meme, then you're going to have to make a new character. It doesn't matter whether or not you're wrong or right, they are perceived as a greytide played by Garnacus.. Ok so here is a perspective I want you to consider. You shitpost a lot in OOC and on Discord. You're a goofy guy sometimes. As I mentioned earlier, your character looks, talks, and sometimes acts like a greytide. You mentioned immediately on round start that you wanted blood bags... over common channel... with vampire being the previous round. You would casually mentioned that you wanted to perform a ritual involving blood to security. ICly that's something odd. OOCly that's something odd. It is more than reasonable to assume that you're playing Butterfill as a joke with all things considered. You don't have to delete your character to fix this, you just have to fix how you play them.

What specifically was changed after my staff complaints in terms of policy and individual behavior? I need to determine whether or not the complaint is really resolved because I'm going to be entirely honest with you, what I'm reading from your posts is that nothing has changed.

When will they be playable?

This isn't the first time someone has used "You think you're the victim" excuse to invalidate anything I have to say and it certainly won't be the last, so let me just address this before it continues to derail the thread. I fucked up. I misread the situation. I didn't think, at the time, my criticism was that harmful, and for that, I apologize. If you or someone else thinks administrative action should be applied, this should either be debated on your circle or in another thread. However that apology comes with a huge asterisk because I genuinely think that given your position, the things you said, and the fact that you're ignoring the fact that you seriously SERIOUSLY fucked up is something to be very concerned about. You did the following - Straight up called me a retard and an annoying shitwad on discord. - Unironically lament that I'm not banned yet. - Said and I quote "I legitimately hate you and wish you'd stop playing here." I did the following - Say your character was a meme and a joke character and gave evidence to prove it. I would completely absolutely understand if I like made a really offensive joke, insulted your mom, or something worth getting legitimately upset about, but I talked shit about your character. Everyone's had their character criticized before, including several of mine, and they don't give a fuck. This is not the case.

I think this is a wonderful change, however I am a bit iffy on the timing. When there wasn't a greytide, security was really fucking strong. Now that there is a greytide, security is pretty weak and its significantly easier to antag because of it. I suggest some sec buffs to go along with this.

No this is a terrible idea. Bump it to 4.

I stated the perception of what your character is. This is how I perceive your character and how people perceive your character. In normal circumstances, whether or not this was your intention is irrelevant because this is how the character is perceived and that's what really matters. In this circumstance, your intentions matter and I'm questioning them right now considering all the interactions I've been in and witnessed with your character could be reasonably concluded with "Yeah this guy is trying to start shit.". I recall that you also play a medical doctor, and you play them quite normally so it's not like you're bad at roleplay or anything. And no, I am not poking the bear. Given how you post on discord, I genuinely thought you were shitposting or at most, laying down some bantz, which is the reason why I asked 5 times for confirmation and the reason why some spectators were like "Wait is he joking or not.". I wasn't trying to provoke you by saying "are you serious" like "are you stupid for believing this" but more like "okay are you legitimately upset for me saying these things." And I also wasn't playing the victim either. I was pointing out about how weird it was that you were accusing me of malice when I wasn't the one who was calling the other person retarded and such. I mean I fucked up by misinterpreting your current attitude and I think you fucked up by saying all the things you said. No one is in the right here, but the reason why I'm even making a fuss about this is that the difference is that I'm just a user, you're one of the head administrators.

BYOND Key: BurgerBB Game ID: Unknown, it would be nice if someone could find it. Player Byond Key: Garnacus Staff involved: None Did you attempt to adminhelp the issue at the time? If so, what was the known action taken by administration/moderation? No, because it only became a problem on discord. Approximate Date/Time: Unknown While talking about how the standards on Aurora have dropped slightly because of the new players on Aurora, I offhand mentioned Garnacus' character, Gregory Buttersworth (name might not be accurate.) Absolutely everyone and their dog knows that Garnacus is playing this character for fun and not for roleplay. The only reason why people know it's garn's character is because whenever people see him do something weird, and someone questions it, someone casually mentions in looc that it's garnacus' character and it should not be taken seriously. I mentioned this and Garnacus got offended. I legitimately couldn't tell if he was shitposting or not so I asked 5 times, and yes. He was being serious. During this encounter, he said some really fucking weird things and I just want to talk about his character first before I get to those things. When the round loaded, gregory buttersworth immediately asked for blood bags. Security comms was like "Okay, that's weird." but we did nothing because it didn't warrant anything, most we did was "Hey uhhh... lets just be careful of this guy." and I'm 90% sure that his previous criminal records were brought up, but I'm not 100% sure. Later in the round, an officer reported seeing them creep around in maintenance; security dismissed this because janitors were probably repairing things. About 5 minutes later, an explosion occurred in maintenance. Gregory Butterfill was considered a suspect, but it wasn't enough evidence to really do anything. I believe over communications and in person, Gregory Butterfill was talking about a ritual they wanted to do over comms (I THINK) and in person. They were also bugging either a Head of Staff or the Captain for blood bags. I think we decided that enough was enough and take him in for questioning and search because of their suspicious conduct. The justification for this warrant was the following: - Asking for bloodbags despite not being qualified to use blood bags. - Performing rituals despite not being a chaplain. -They were last seen in maintenance when a bomb or something exploded in maintenance. He was brought to security. We searched him, and found two syringes filled with blood. A janitor should not have these two items. By definition, they're considered contraband as per the wiki: https://wiki.aurorastation.org/index.php?title=Guide_to_Contraband Gregory Butterworth proceeded to kick up a storm when the syringes were confiscated and tested. They did contain his blood, however we we uncomfortable with a very suspicious janitor having two syringes without the proper paperwork. We didn't really end up charging him for it, and let them off with a warning. I don't recall who the Captain was, but I would very much like them to comment if someone could find them. It was incredibly obvious that his character motives were formed from an OCCly perspective. He wanted people to think that the current round type was vampire or cult and then call people out for metagaming, which he ended up doing today when I brought up that incident. I think that the entire situation was bait. I had a feeling before, which is why I didn't say anything earlier or ahelped it or anything, but now I can say with certainty that I genuinely believe that it was bait. I mean obviously at the time when they were doing all those things, almost everyone thought "Oh jeez this is a new player being vampire." and the security department did their god damn hardest not to think of it, which is why we didn't immediately detain him for questioning despite many occurances of suspicious behavior. So upon using this example of "It's not against the rules to being annoying." Garnacus proceeded to say some really messed up things and was legitimately offended. I had to ask if he was sincere 5 times, given that he tends to joke around a lot and the things that he said. I was being pretty cocking in the conversation because I genuinely thought it was just bants, but as the conversation grew and grew it was just fucking awful. https://i.imgur.com/LyPXBef.png https://i.imgur.com/G6uhjRW.png https://i.imgur.com/BxgxMTn.png https://i.imgur.com/yFenMWD.png The conversation got clearly heated, but there are some things that I don't think can be taken back.

Also those are partial logs. I would very much like access to the full logs because there is a lot more that was said after it.

At the time when, you even admitted, there was only one janitor, unless I misread what you said. It was the only janitor I've seen all shift so I assumed it was the only janitor. I fucked up on my part, but perhaps I'm asking too much when you probably should've asked for clarification. I know I should've been clearer, but if there were two janitors perhaps you should've asked which janitor it was. Bothering chemistry while chemistry is very hard at work for space drugs because of memes and not roleplay is a pretty huge dick move. It delays the production of vital chemicals and it wastes my time on effort on someone who's only here because they think it's goon and didn't bother to read the rules. I'm fine with new players; I'm just not fine with new players who didn't take 2 seconds to read the first paragraph of the rules and realise this isn't goonstation. They interrupted work. They didn't put effort into typing. They used their Janitor all-access to literally go to the chemistry back counter to bug me, blocking doctors from getting chems, and as I mentioned, taking chems that I left out for other doctors. They were also bumping into doctors constantly. They were asked to leave several times but they would eventually come back via their Janitor all access. They would also get in the way of treatment and go "r u okay" to those with their head split open while a doctor behind them was trying to fix them. It is also one of the WORST things you can do to a dionaea who needs to get there because you're slowing them down SIGNIFICANTLY more by swapping with them several times. In recent days, I've had to walk around with disarm intent so no one swaps with me, but usually they'd just go on harm intent and push me out of the way or straight up disarm me as Yonnimer witnessed one time. Cleaning an active crime scene while security is literally around it placing tape everywhere is an OOC issue because realistically a janitor with the amount of disregard for security would never be hired. They were going to be arrested, but Evandorf who was playing HoS at the time stepped in and just gave them a warning, very likely because they were new and didn't want to subject a new player to a timeout and not like the server. Also I believe you do not remember the series of events correctly. I said they were drinking chemicals, you asked what chemicals. I said bleach, you said "What specifically." and I gave you Space Cleaner. This was all in the span of a few messages. This was not "After quite some time." When I asked for another admin to deal with this, I was just sick of the situation and sick of how they were handling it. I sensed a little hostility by them too (not to say I wasn't being aggressive either) By contrast, a greytide disarm pushed me once, which I didn't have an issue with, and Yonnimer bwoinked me saying that I should report bad behavior like that before. Another greytider, a cadet who absolutely could not stop drinking phoron soda after being told not to by medical three times and had to treat them for toxins three times, was ahelped by me. Alberyk said that he talked to him about it. Again, by contrast, a janitor who was drinking bleach for the memes, asking for space drugs without a prescription for the memes, and cleaning blood for the memes, and basically doing everything for the memes got a "Being annoying isn't against the rules."

BYOND Key: BurgerBB Staff BYOND Key: Pratepresidenten Game ID: bZk-dEsn Reason for complaint: Poor handling of ahelp Evidence/logs/etc: None provided. Alberyk said to make the complaint for logs. Right. So I was reminded to make a player complaint by Alberyk after mocking me on discord. Basically I don't think the ahelp I made was professionally handled. I understand mods are volunteers, but good lord it was just infuriating to deal with. A player (Name was Ned Kazynski) who was clearly new was causing issues in medical, generally being annoying. They were asking for drugs, painkillers, bumping into other doctors trying to treat patients, cleaning ACTIVE crime scenes, taking medicine from medical and putting it elsewhere, drinking bleach, being a nuisance. I stated all this, and the response I got was "It's not against the rules to be annoying." Kinda gave me a bit of a shock considering last round I was told to ahelp someone who pushed me once via disarm. So I tried explaining to them that this behavior is not okay and clearly against the rules for characters. I was pretty pissed off before the ahelp, so I was quite confrontational. I explained everything they did again and they didn't seem to give that much of a care. They asked me if I had any screenshots of this, and I provided them with this. https://imgur.com/a/m6mjIxA They then seemed to act a little passive aggressive and give me shit for not directly stating a name, which I apologized for, but they were (at the time of the complaint) the only janitor on the manifest. I mean the player was eventually dealt with, but it should not have took this long and with the attitude given. There were points where I asked for a different admin to handle this, which I regret, but it seemed reasonable at the time considering they weren't very happy in dealing with me and I wasn't happy with dealing with them. There was also a previous ahelp where I was bwoinked for bringing the syringe gun to the main level which was a bit weird.

I believe this was also done to one of the IAA agents at the end of the round where @nursiekitty and some others were roleplaying with Nathan Corvo. It was quite confusing.

ChairRPing with a psych and a captain for 2 hours only entertains the psych and the captain. It's a waste of a slot.

Could always limit the amount of vampires that could be converted by one person to something reasonable like 2. On top that, you could also limit conversions to round-start vampires. "Solo hunters" doesn't really have good gimmicks because it usually translates into "solo interaction".

Why are you quoting a word that I never said. If you are referring to me saying "No one plays it." that's an over exaggeration. Very few people play vampire because it's very difficult to come up with some sort of gimmick if you're an HRP player, and it's very difficult to really do anything if you're not. As a player, I can only think of one solid antag gimmick as a vampire player without the feature. I can think of 4 if this feature was added and let me establish my harem of vampires.

It is not well designed. No one plays it. Not many people like it as a gamemode, but many people are fine with it because it's just another extended gamemode. On most rounds, there are only 2 vampires in a manifest of 25. Out of those 2, one of them usually chairrp's with security or medical, and the other one is a new players who has no clue what to do. I'm pretty sure that vampire was a disliked gamemode in that 2018 survey regarding gamemodes, but in general the results of the survey has been largely ignored so I don't know if it's even relevant anymore. If you're concerned about rivalry, ake it a choice by both the person giving the suck and the person receiving the suck if a concern of rivalry is a thing.

Antags slightly taking a more relaxed approach to antaging results in either chairrp or nothing happening until the 1:30 mark. You could argue that this 2/3rds majority garbage contributes to bad antaggery as it lets traitors get away with having their preferences checked without having any gimmicks in mind while playing. I've seen too many fucking times where the antag does literally nothing for 1 hours and 59 minutes, but they suddenly start to announce themselves and people vote continue along with the cries of "GIVE THEM A CHANCE, SOMETHING IS HAPPENING!!!" like idiots and then complain about how coming up with a gimmick in 2 hours is hard. If engineers or whatever have a large project going, and the people are properly informed of it, then 9 times out of 10 more than 50% of the people vote to continue. If people genuinely don't give a shit then they won't vote continue. And I don't know about you. I've seen plenty of bullshit vote calls in my day involving antags crazy going on a rampage to the point where the top 4 words being "we're dealing with it" and people cheering them on. Happens frequently in cult/crossfire/raider rounds. The opposite happens frequently too where because there is literally nothing going on, people vote to continue because they get a free extended round. I'm not an expert in gameplay but I'm an expert in being a player, and I can tell you right now that all these features that make extended happen more often is just malicious. If people want extended, they should vote extended, and not rely on bad game mechanics so they get secret extended, "antags are doing literally nothing" extended, or "the gamemode is so bad it might as well be extended" extended.

If 51% of people vote to end the shift, then that means 51% of people would rather see a new round. That's a majority. That shouldn't be up for debate and that should be the thing that ends all arguments.

Most forms of media, modern and old, state that if you're bitten by a vampire you'll likely turn into one. As far as I can tell, there is 0 lore on Vampires in this universe.

If not automatically, then make embrace free. Alternatively, could make it like rev or cult where you can choose to be a vampire or not when sucked off.

Vamp rounds have a history of being shit. It's the second worst gamemode, next to ling, but no one complains about it because there is never not a peaceful vamp round and Vamp doesn't involve killing people. I suggest making it more interesting by implementing the following: If you're sucked off by a vampire, you become a vampire. Willingly, or no. I feel that this will make the rounds much more interesting and RP driven given the conflict created. I feel that this would also be a good addition considering out of like 40 players, only 2 of them have vamp enabled. It will also not make it a stealth gamemode anymore since people are now aware that they were sucked off, which will that 99% of rounds will no longer end in "Wait, it was vamp?" Yeah, embrace exists, or whatever, but it requires like 5 people worth of blood to use on one person.

I don't think you understand what I'm saying in the OP. If a majority of players want the round to end, then the round should end. If 75% of the players want the round to continue, then it should continue. If 50% of the players want the round to continue, then it should continue. If 49% of the players want the round to continue, then the round should end. Then roleplay in the next round. This isn't about voting to end because you don't like roleplay, this is about voting to end because the current round is shit.