Butterrobber202 Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 Pretty simple idea present in this thread: Change standard Security SOP to not enter maintenance tunnels without a probable cause. Officially it could look like Spoiler Due to a incidents involving Security Officers getting wounded in maintenance tunnels, it has been decided that Officers should only enter the tunnels with probable cause on Code Green. Note that this does not apply on Code Blue or Red Reasons for this change are listed in the linked thread, with alot of input from multiple sides.
Nantei Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 Maintenance isn't a department, it isn't searched, and this will be incredibly difficult to enforce. It makes absolutely perfect sense that Security would sweep maintenance, and if it really bothers you so much that they do it at round start, wait literally just twenty or so minutes and nobody will be in maintenance again. Also other departments will also swing into maintenance, anyone can really, they just don't because they have roundstart chores and Security does not. I'm also generally not pleased at the tone implying that this is something security mains do to shut down antags. Please do not demonize people.
Dark1Star Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 Well, actually the only reason I search maint is to find them damn cat ears... or get one of those extended oxygen tanks.
Butterrobber202 Posted October 9, 2019 Author Posted October 9, 2019 1 minute ago, Nantei said: Maintenance isn't a department, it isn't searched, and this will be incredibly difficult to enforce. It makes absolutely perfect sense that Security would sweep maintenance, and if it really bothers you so much that they do it at round start, wait literally just twenty or so minutes and nobody will be in maintenance again. Also other departments will also swing into maintenance, anyone can really, they just don't because they have roundstart chores and Security does not. I'm also generally not pleased at the tone implying that this is something security mains do to shut down antags. Please do not demonize people. Well for starters, I'm not here to please you. I'm here because I have an idea that I believe will improve gameplay for everyone. Thats the point of the suggestions forum. Second off, I'm not implying that ALL of security is doing this, but there is little else to do to get the results. if you have a suggestion feel free to shoot it. Third off, this will not be hard to enforce at all. Just have officers follow SoP, and if they break it, fine them accordingly. Finally, I do believe that some Security mains do this to hamper antags, regardless if you like that or not. It's a fact there are people who have those intents in mind. Again, I'm not saying every Sec Main does this, but there are some who do it to get the upper hand. Spoiler also, the main reason I'm against is, as you would've seen in the other thread is: Whats the point of having an RNG Item Spawner if one group instantly hordes all of those items at round start?
Nantei Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 20 minutes ago, Butterrobber202 said: Honestly, I think the practice stems from the fact that most Security mains would prefer removing the chance an antag might have the upper hand rather than letting some cool happen. 20 minutes ago, Butterrobber202 said: Second off, I'm not implying that ALL of security is doing this, but there is little else to do to get the results. if you have a suggestion feel free to shoot it. You quite directly said it. It's a very bad faith argument, which will make this not very convincing, which is why I am telling you this. Also I am telling you as a staff member, having to talk to security officers about why they are in an area they have access to is extremely silly, and not something I would look forward to. We've established in your prior thread that there's not that much great loot in maintenance, and that the warehouse is dramatically better if you're an antag looking to gear up on contraband. So the concern is antags doing things in maintenance at roundstart? What exactly is the rational behind that at all? It's very easy for the antagonist to just avoid the tunnels until after ten or so minutes, when Security will have finished their sweep. Few officers enter maintenance after that. And if you are doing something that incredibly high profile at round start you may wish to rethink your gameplan as an antagonist. As someone who does a fair bit of antaggery, I frankly have zero concern about security sweeping maintenance. Hence why I pointed out the bad faith origins of this proposal. I similarly wanted to point it out to help you better craft your argument, because I know from experience that won't be persuasive to people who don't already agree with you. If you turn this into Us vs Them then it won't go anywhere productive. If you think an officer is guilty of powergaming or validhunty behavior, please contact staff, and we can keep an eye on them.
Carver Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 (edited) I'm going to go with no because your reasoning is biased against Security in particular, as this suggestion doesn't discourage literally any other department or role from going into maintenance to do the exact same thing: loot shit. Quote I'm here because I have an idea that I believe will improve gameplay for everyone. Thats the point of the suggestions forum. I like to imagine this idea is to benefit you and you alone, for the above reason. Edited October 9, 2019 by Carver
Rushodan Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 Maint is absolutely huge, is fully of hidey holes and a smart antag can always manufacture some with hidden walls if they want to be extra safe and secure. I really do not see the need to keep security out of the one place that is poorly lit, dangerous and often provides the antag plenty of opportunities to ambush if they so choose. How would that SoP work even? Someone stabs someone and dabs into maint but officers can't pursue because its green? Or do they need to get a special warrant or what? If its a hard ban until code blue then what happens on low pop rounds where literally nobody can raise the code level? I really don't enjoy the notion that security players are going around maint and looking for contraband to purposely fuck over the antag - mostly for the reason that Nantei mentioned. I can agree with @Nantei that as someone who gets thrown into an antag role due to their luck half the time, I can't say I have ever wasted the first part of my round looking for a cool item to support a gimmick. Rev is actually the only one I can think of that would even need/want to do this. @Carver Also raises an excellent point - what about literally any department that wants to walk around and do the same thing? I know of some CTs that do it to add to the warehouse stock / so it can be sent to the right department. I've even done it once on a rather slow extended round.
Doxxmedearly Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 (edited) While I rag on and generally dislike many sec mains for more reasons than I care to list, I can't say I agree with this. Is it shitty for sec to round up all the stuff in maint and shove it away? Yeah. It's pretty lame. I encourage them to overlook more stuff, maybe it'll spark some ridiculous RP down the line if a CT or Janitor finds it. Maybe not. Let someone carry around a boot knife for a round and enjoy it, even if it's never used. Is it affecting antags? Hardly. Most of this stuff is useless or accessible. It's just fun. Though when sec gets really picky and starts taking insulateds and empty combat belts it's kinda a crap move. Maint diving is fun. Finding junk is fun, whether it's a mask or a captain's backpack or a knife or a plushie. I don't think security should be excluded from that just because some of their players are joyless hoarders. Edited October 9, 2019 by Doxxmedearly
Brutishcrab51 Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 Hard no to this. ISD is unlikely to have "injuries and accidents" in maintenance more than the Janitor, Cargo Technicians, Researchers or Engineers that I've all ran into while going into maintenance as a Sec Officer. This is heavily biased and targeted towards one specific group that happens to look in Maintenance, while doing nothing to limit other characters or departments. That's the point, though, isn't it? Just to limit Security. Real hard no.
Scheveningen Posted October 9, 2019 Posted October 9, 2019 Gonna also say no to this, for reasons already stated. Diving into maintenance as any job is not a crime.
Alberyk Posted December 2, 2019 Posted December 2, 2019 Moving to archive in the light of recent access changes.
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