Remove Player Controlled Mouse

[UnknownMurder]

Some of us have read Nanako's staff complaint. We don't need players controlling mouse. We have seen mice pointing at machines, acting like a pet, and etc. I feel like this is a good solution we should all aim for. We don't need to waste our time to form regulations on mice. They're pretty common sense. Mice are stupid people. They know nothing about machines. They should be running away from humans not purring up like a cat. Shame on those people. I'm sure many of us agree to remove it.

I form this suggestion to remove the Player Controlled Mouse and let it be an entirety NPC.

[VileFault]

My god, stop the mice war! Why the hell are we worked up over mice? Listen, if a mouse wants to come into science and start pointing at things we should deconstruct, I am content to ignore or kill it. They are stupid little pests! Nobody has to care about mice. If you really think this is such a problem, then just put a little cooldown on becoming mice. Some people enjoy it, in the same way as I find playing a drone vaguely therapeutic. I don't think admins need to spend much of their time dealing with _mice_ infractions, since players can very easily deal with these sorts of problems on their own.

[Synnono]

They are stupid little pests!

 

This.

If you like their RP as cartoon caricatures, embrace it.

If you don't, murder them freely.

Don't feel the need to raise hell. The game is just full of jokes. Player mice is one of them. We've done worse as humans or humanoids in the round. Staff has done worse. Drones have done worse. There's no need to call formal attention to this. People playing mice should know better, and most of the time they will.

[UnknownMurder]

Don't feel the need to raise hell. The game is just full of jokes. Player mice is one of them. We've done worse as humans or humanoids in the round. Staff has done worse. Drones have done worse. There's no need to call formal attention to this. People playing mice should know better, and most of the time they will.

 

But, we don't like the joke. It's not funny.

[Synnono]

But, we don't like the joke.

 

I implore you to pick up a crowbar, toggle harm intent, and click once, maybe twice, on the offender. It takes at most two hits.

[Zundy]

If you want a mechanic removed UM, it needs to be replaced with something else. You've not suggested anything.

Regardless mice should stay, 'AAAAHHHH :O' is just having as moment is all.

[Guest]

But, we don't like the joke.

 

I implore you to pick up a crowbar, toggle harm intent, and click once, maybe twice, on the offender. It takes at most two hits.

 

5 minute respawn timer. wew.

I remember the old days when they didn't have a respawn timer, and Meowykins and I made a mouse swastika in cargo, and SoundScopes had to tell us to knock it off.

Good times.

[Fiskap]

No need to remove this entire mechanic, just write up some proper rules on how they should act.

[coolbc2000]

What even in the fuck has happened, a week in Spain and this meme goes out of control...

[Guest Menown]

No need to remove this entire mechanic, just write up some proper rules on how they should act.

 

Implying that's easy to do without somebody being mocked, if you go so far as to even suggest it :^)

[Nanako]

hello

Please leave me alone, thats really all ive ever wanted for a mouse

UM has shot me plenty of times, and i usually took that as a cue to leave, and find other places to mouse around in

getting worked up about this is silly. I had a disagreement with a moderator who suddenly wanted to police mouse RP.

I haven't even coded any new mouse features in like, a month. I'm too busy coding other nice things for you guys, like a sprinting system.

I just drop into the server for an hour or two in the evenings, mouse around and see what's going on, meet people, get cheese, and stamped on a lot. I'm not affecting your rounds and i'm generally RPing a mouse to the best of my abilities

One of the biggest complaints about our alien races is that they're too human. Mice are one of the most alien playable things we actually have, it'd be bad to take away gameplay variety

And just because you don't like mice, doesnt mean much. Some people find them cute and cheerful to have around. And some people, likely including several in this thread, hate them, but also like having them around for target practise

[DatBerry]

i like player controlled mice, especially when they're shitlers, why? it forces the crew to deal with it.

a few days ago we had someone ahelp about mice eating the armory boxes and making a mess, so? deal with it ICly, you have mouse traps for a reason. half the janitor's job is dealing with pests.

player controlled mice make them more of a pest than they are, and they should be real pests, not a little kawaii sugoi pet-chan desu~

while you can do the latter, i enjoy making the crew miserable more. so i say we should keep mice, no reason to remove features if they aren't totally broken.

[Skull132]

I have a principle of not removing things for reasons like this.

Generally because these issues will eventually get resolved at the administrative level, so we'll be short an issue in the near future. If we also remove the mechanic tied to the issue, we'd be short an issue and a mechanic.

Addendum:

The only things to look at from the mechanical perspective are outright possibilities for abuse. Such as squeek-spamming, which was resolved by a patch; and maybe respawn timers. But at the moment, this seems like a singular case being blown infinitely out of proportion. Doubly so when the administration is fully capable of dealing with the matter at hand, and will deal with it.

[Ricky_the_banshee]

Wow, okay. Uhm.

So, I see where this complaint is all about. I agree, I'm not a fan of the way some players treat the mice role as. I've seen people pointing at equipment while playing a mouse or abusing emotes to communicate with their "owners". What's the most common ICly solution to that? Squish the living shit out of them.

Then there are mice who actually play as REAL mice. They nibble on boxes in the Armory, try and steal food, became a general nuisance to the crew. What's the IC solution to them? Squish the living shit out of them.

So, back to the whole ordeal with Mice players pulling they're adorable pet shenanigans and semi-intelligent somehow(?). In reality, Mice have the brain smaller than a peanut, which means they're driven by quite basic insticts. Mice will do anything to avoid contact with Humans (Or Alien Humanoids) because it's one of their primary insticts to avoid potentional dangers, they're vigilant animals. Just because a human kneels down to them and offers them food does NOT mean a Mice will consider them a friend, let alone /consider/ it. They will RUN away.

Looking at mice doing the exact opposite, playing some sort of pet while pointing at equipment and subtly emote-communicate with their owner is not just Bad-RP, it's also abuse of an established restriction placed on your role. There is no NEED to remove the entire mechanic as a whole, just notify a staff member when you see the emote ''Mouse (666) thinks (out loud I guess?) that George Melons should watch the Alert consoles'' and we'll have a look at it. As Skull said, it's for the best we fix things at an administrative level first before we go remove an entire mechanic.

To give my answer to this issue, should player-controlled mice be removed? No. Should there be more regs enforced upon player-controlled mice? No. Why? Because we have already have a rule for that. It's called remaining in-character. It's not that hard to google how mice truely behave, and as some players may find this dissapointing to hear, but none of them will ever attempt to befriend Humans or even allow them to befriend them. They're creatures bend on survival who'll avoid as much contact with anyone not part of their kind.

[Nanako]

because it's one of their primary insticts to avoid potentional dangers, they're vigilant animals. Just because a human kneels down to them and offers them food does NOT mean a Mice will consider them a friend, let alone /consider/ it. They will RUN away.

 

finding food is also a core instinct, and giving food to animals has been a tried and tested way of taming them for millenia. mice learn pretty quickly

[UnknownMurder]

No need to remove this entire mechanic, just write up some proper rules on how they should act.

 

Who's going to do it?

To Skull & Rick,

I await for the time that comes.

To Rick,

This is a suggestion, not a complaint.

To Nanako,

You definitely should have known better before creeping up to people who's willingly to kill a mouse whom being a general nuisance and acting humane.

______

Now that people have drawn complaints while anti-mouse people lies behind my back, I offer a suggestion, a change to the mechanic. Cockroaches. There should be a better pests than a mouse, let's say cockroaches for instance. They contain no knowledge but a better substitution to replace mice trying to be human. Bugs for instance, often scatters away at the sight of humans.

[Ricky_the_banshee]

because it's one of their primary insticts to avoid potentional dangers, they're vigilant animals. Just because a human kneels down to them and offers them food does NOT mean a Mice will consider them a friend, let alone /consider/ it. They will RUN away.

 

finding food is also a core instinct, and giving food to animals has been a tried and tested way of taming them for millenia. mice learn pretty quickly

 

That doens't really change the fact that the food is overwhelmed with Human scent. If their sense of fear overwhelmes their sense of hunger or vise versa, they'll prefer to run OR even fight if it's necessary, ESPECIALLY when the Human is still present amongst the food. Then again, these aren't domesticated/tamed mice, so it doesn't matter to them. Their sense of danger comes first as most animals do. I can imagine the situation would go differently if the Human left a stash of food alone at one location and remain distant for a while, the scent could cause the mice to avoid it BUT should truely be hungry, they'll take their chance as the potentional threat is not visually present.

Still, I find it too much to just remove the mechanic itself. If all players can simply agree that mice exist for the purpose of being a pseudo-observe role with a minor RP role of being a general nuisance. Then all of this could work out just fine.

[Pyrociraptor]

Okay so that whole Mice Meme is getting really, reaaaally out of hand. I mean, we're getting Staff complaints about mice, Player complaint about mice... Suggestions against mice..

I mean, mice are just here for spectators that just want to annoy the crew... They're still basic creatures.

At least, let science use them for science.

[makkenhoff]

Well, if we consider mice as a player, would this complaint be necessary? Keep in mind I don't have an issue with mice, nor with more human-ish mice. I mean, hell, we are in space with genetic cloning that takes minutes complete with previous memories. Give the reality check a break; this is a game about silliness that has extra rules for the purpose of fostering role-play as is fitting for a role-playing server. I'd be the first one to admit, I've seen pretty stupid things with mice, and drones for that matter. I've seen the same from humans and in some cases aliens which are thankfully a bit more policed here.

The easiest solution at the administration level, is to equally apply the rules. This means a roleplay nerf for mouse behavior certainly, the application of which would result in mice unable to point or generally do any action outside of your standard mouse. Since a mouse lacks any human skill whatsoever, it would be incapable of doing anything that would even resemble human behavior. If a mouse wished to have such a "skill" it should be required to apply for a whitelist, just like aliens, because it is a non-standard human player. Personally, I've seen Nanako doing the mouse thing, and sometimes it bugs me. When I see complaints about being squished as a mouse, that really annoys me, especially when I'm in dead chat, having been killed. I just think, ultimately, more options should be considered first, before removal is considered.

A few options off the top of my head:

As a regular mouse it is consistent with powergaming/meta behavior to do things a mouse would not know/understand, no new rules need be created, apply it to misbehaving players or staff and be done with it.

Add a few "pet" options for those who would like to be a cuddly pet; perhaps even whitelist it, while policing it within the already written rules, I've seen it add to roleplay, I've also seen it horribly detract from it when too many are added for the sake of having them.

Another option, though admittedly it could easily end up more outlandish than I intend, is to allow a more intelligent mouse, perhaps even calling it a "lab rat". Applying it to science makes sense, as someone else suggested, though admittedly that is a lot more dev work to come up with a good reason to have them aboard, and some use in testing. Perhaps in Xenoflora as human analogs for chemical testing? Xenoflora doesn't really have a huge area to work out of, so it would make sense to keep a small number of rat cages. These could perhaps be antagonists for a lab rat escape game mode, for the more audacious idea.

I can see why removal should be considered, I just don't think it should be the first consideration, as it appears to me to be.

[SierraKomodo]

Drones have done worse

 

Maintenance Drone (937) states: Carpfucker 300 online

[Eternias]

Drones have done worse

 

Maintenance Drone (937) states: Carpfucker 300 online

 

+1

[Skull132]

Now that people have drawn complaints while anti-mouse people lies behind my back, I offer a suggestion, a change to the mechanic. Cockroaches. There should be a better pests than a mouse, let's say cockroaches for instance. They contain no knowledge but a better substitution to replace mice trying to be human. Bugs for instance, often scatters away at the sight of humans.

 

Realize what this proposal made clear just now: You pretty much stated that your suggestion isn't actually to deal with a specific mechanic that's abuseble or a mechanical issue in general, but rather to deal with a specific individual or playstyle. Because: the mechanical change from mouse to cockroach on its own would leave the same gaps in policy and enforcement that people are attempting to expand upon right now. It would only resolve the present concern, as it were, while taking no proactive measures to ensure that such shenanigans do not happen again in the future.

No thank you.

The issue you're getting at is one to be solved at the administrative level, not at the developmental and code one.

[Guest Complete Garbage]

I have a feeling this might turn into another 10-page shitpost meme.

Anyway, I agree with Skull. Also, how will player cockroaches be any different? It's the exact same principle, and people will do what they do reguardless of whether it's a mouse or a cockroach. If someone is breaking roleplay, ahelp or write a complaint. If you're finding player mice to be too much cancer, suggest an increase in the mouse re spawn timer.

[Zundy]

To be honest I do agree that we should change mice to something that's not cute and cuddly. Can't we have some sort of invasive alien species? It's over 400 years in the future famalams!

[Bedshaped]

I would suggest the following mechanical changes instead of removing them:

• Remove a mouse's ability to point
  
• Remove a mouse's ability to use custom emotes
  
• Remove a mouse's ability to come within 1 tile of a human mob
  
• Remove the mouse's ability to squeal or loudly squeek