On the Rework of Psychology

[Jennalele]

No.

No.

God. Fucking. No.

On a more coherent and serious note. This PR is an absolutely terrible execution of what could have been a nice re-work. Let's break this down into parts.

Electroconvulsie Therapy (ECT)

This is the worst red-flag here. I am someone who has taken psychology classes. I considered becoming a psychiatrist if the field weren't so fucked up right now. So. What is ECT? The definition from Wikipedia says the following. Electroconvulsive therapy (ECT), formerly known as electroshock therapy, and often referred to as shock treatment, is a psychiatric treatment in which seizures are electrically induced in patients to provide relief from mental disorders.

But here's the thing. ECT is outdated. In 2018, it is an absolute last-ditch-effort when absolutely everything else has been exhausted over a period of years. It causes retrograde amnesia in almost every single case. You are also not strapped to a chair and shocked to shit. I don't understand why we're using the 1940s method that is effectively traumatic torture in the 2460s. There have to be better methods.

Hypnotic Therapy

....Is a form of cognitive therapy that has...ehm.... debated results. I don't understand why this one can't just be kept to RP.

Isolation Therapy

...Is a form of torture! Congratulations! The last thing you want to do to a terrified client experiencing hallucinations is lock them, totally alone, in a room with nothing to hear but "tick. tick. tick. tick." All I can say, honestly, is what the fuck.

On the Chaplain

The chaplain can also cure isolation and electroshock traumas by dispelling the demons within with his bible.

Hi. As someone who's actually experienced an exorcism due to batshit fucking insane family who thought my depression was caused by demons, not only is this a "what the fuck, why did you add this for anything but memes," but in an actual context of experience, one again, you've traumatized your patient.

 

---

---

 

Okay. Now let's focus on how I think we can change this.

Firstly, I don't understand why a workplace requires a fully-equipped psychiatric ward that currently looks more like a torture ward or a scene out of One Flew Over The Cuckoos Nest. A lot of these traumas, I feel, should be managed on station, and treated long-term off-station. I don't know why everything has to be cured in 5 minutes, and I'd argue we may even get more RP out of management instead of Diagnose > Cure > Slap On Ass > Send On Way. Psych has always been a heavy-RP role, and I really, really like that. It's one of the few roles that really depends on being able to talk to others. It's not a mechanics slog.

In today's world, the first line of defense against most mental illnesses is medication and different forms of cognitive therapy. They are also not cured overnight. I know, I know, you will all bitch that "but heart surgery shouldn't take 30 seconds, either." My point is that I think this can be better executed. So my suggestions are as follows.

Concussions, depending on severity, should either go away very very slowly on their own, or just be treatable with Alkysine as general brain injury.

For traumas that are related to the nervous and muscular systems, as well as things like blindness & mutism, we should re-implement the old brain surgery method that involved... I believe the fix-o-vein and hemostat. Perhaps alter it mildly depending on what's damaged, or bring up a pop-up message of "what are you poking around in?" or something in order to pin-point treat the problem. Because of how severely these can affect your round, I don't mind these being insta-cures.

For traumas such as schizophrenia/imaginary friend, and violent psychosis, I suggest a slow-metabolizing medication, clonazepam, to treat them and keep the symptoms suppressed for as long as they're in the system.

For Narcolepsy, good old Methylphenidate may finally see a use, as it's a stimulant and those are most often prescribed to treat the disorder.

For phobias, I'm at a slight loss. I'm not sure why they're an actual trauma. It feels really cheesy to have to use a fuckin' hypnotizer to cure it though. I'd either make a motion to remove this one altogether or make it treatable with an anti-anxiety medication.

...And let's leave Godwoken Syndrome and Bluespace Prophecy as they are. Some things weren't meant to be treated. Let the games begin.

My TL;DR is that I think there's a better execution for this to make treatment of trauma more diverse, still involve the psychiatrist, but avoid the shit-show of ECT and Isolation Therapy (and letting chaplains pray away mental illnesses which is imo really fucking dumb.)

[Sytic]

Isn't electroshock therapy illegal in some countries/states, hypnotic therapy has no merit, and isolation therapy is actual torture? Why is this even being suggested?

[TheSleepyCatmom]

I entirely agree. As a medical professional, ECT in and of itself is always a last ditch effort and is /very frowned illegal/ to be used in many countries.. There is no way in hell I'm going to standby with this as a primary option for care of a patient. Nor will I literally let a fucking electric chair be in my medical bay, ever, we're not an execution ward and we all know it's going to be used as it anyway.

With my little tiny rant out of the way, we've gone 500 years into the future from when ECT would have been acceptable as a primary care option, and with technological superiority over it and drugs that literally cure 95% of any injuries you can get (literally everything besides bone repair), there has to be better options than "Strap to Chair>Shock the shit out of"

Beyond this some of the other therapies are even moreso retarded to have in this game, as the role itself is RP and it shouldn't be long-term solutions as stated.

[Bygonehero]

While it's easy to tear something down for lack of realism, I have to completely disagree with you. All of your suggestions boil down to make a prescription. This is neither fun nor really stimulating for anyone playing the psych or anyone they interview. You need to understand that this is a game, so any semblance of real-world subjects, topics and objects needs to be seen through the filter of a game to make it fun. These mechanics ARE fun, they were designed to avoid passivity and chair RP. Just because they exist in game, it doesn't mean they have no roleplay potential, nor does it mean to take away any of what you had before. There's not much reason for a psych, chaplain bartender, and chef to be on a space station in the first place when a shift canonically lasts two hours but they are because those roles are fun.

[TheSleepyCatmom]

No; I'm all for making treatments that'd make sense that don't fuck with people as they would if you're trying to implement it 'correctly'. And I fully expect things to be added for it, not that any of our bitching is going to change anyone's mind. But not a cure-all be-all of mental issues on station. It makes no sense, if we could do this in the first place, why not just make a drug that cures it? You'd be achieving the same thing, and Psychiatrist can still be the RP centered role it is without having change like this.

But that's not quite what this is about. The issue I have is these treatments are illegal currently, and even HARMFUL more then they are good. The ones brought up in the PR would be acceptable 500 years ago from current game year, but its' been 500 years. And being as NT is a mainly-human corporation, and [mention]Zundy[/mention] can tell us whether or not humanity has done anything with these in the past so many years, we're going off the assumption it's going to be treated as it is now. Like a crime. You're not going to setup an electric shock chair on a spacestation to cure mental illnesses.

You're not going to tell the chaplain to exorcism mental illness from a patient, that'd simply fuck them even more. Have you ever gone through a man, screaming at you with a bible in hand and a rod of obsidian trying to purge demons from you, when you're schizophrenic or paranoid? I'm sure that'll simply end well anyway.

Beyond this, Isolation Therapy would be literal torture. 'Therapy'. Its a very wrong term to give something like this, you're locking someone away and doing absolutely nothing with them. This isn't inducing RP, like I can maybe understand the chaplain doing. This is locking someone away because they're ill mentally and hoping to god it'll fix it. This is worse than giving people amnesia from ECT.

Look, I understand the want to add mechanics to the Psychiatric role, but I think we need to do it in a way that doesn't involve literal torture methods as 'therapy'. This is 'fun' if you're a sadistic prick.

/endrant

[Zundy]

ECT is legal in the US and the EU and still practiced. Where is everyone getting the idea it's both banned and horrific? The "mad scientist shocking the delicate psychiatric patient" is a Hollywood meme.

Tech wise I like the idea of an IG device for this, but not ECF per se.

[TheSleepyCatmom]

When I think electroshock therapy in a game, I'm thinking a literal electric chair. If that's not what it's being used as my apologies, but it's not used where I'm from nor is it legal, so I go off of where I am.

I should say, its very clear that it's not safe based on the 'drawbacks' of it from the PR itself. Which is what I'm going off of.

[Azande]

ECT is legal in the US and the EU and still practiced. Where is everyone getting the idea it's both banned and horrific? The "mad scientist shocking the delicate psychiatric patient" is a Hollywood meme.

Tech wise I like the idea of an IG device for this, but not ECF per se.

 

The United States is a fucked up place. Let's not take ideas from them. They shock da gays.

Europe is an old place, they always take a bit longer to uh, come up to 'modern' standards. (You know what they say about the Welsh, right?)

[Jennalele]

There is literally a modified electric chair.

ECT is an absolute last resort when EVERYTHING else has been exhausted to no avail. It should not be the first line of treatment. ESPECIALLY in 2460.

[LordRaven001]

I don't give a fuck about any of the other changes, But I am extremely against Electroshock Therapy. Electroshock Therapy's official title is Electroconvulsive Therapy, and its CURRENTLY right now being used unlawfully against numerous individuals because of their sexuality, or mental disability.

Electroconvulsive Therapy is, as Lord Fowl said. A last ditch effort, which would be preformed in a HOSPITAL not on a Research Station. Lets take this excerpt from the National Health Service in the United Kingdom and see what it recommends "Its use was recommended "only to achieve rapid and short-term improvement of severe symptoms after an adequate trial of treatment options has proven ineffective and/or when the condition is considered to be potentially life-threatening in individuals with severe depressive illness, catatonia or a prolonged manic episode".[79]" No way in hell would Nanotrasen hire someone who has severe depression, is in a coma, or having a prolonged manic episode. It wouldn't even make sense to have it in the game.

If you're still not convinced lets look at another exert this time from a Physician's view on the subject or more-so on the effects Electroconvulsive Therapy has on the Memory"Retrograde amnesia occurs to some extent in almost all ECT recipients." Why would Nanotrasen want to debilitate their employees? That would cause so many problems, they would have to hire new staff, pay for the damages, and justify what they did in the public eye, which would fail. Lets look at some more side effects "ECT, especially if combined with deep sleep therapy, may lead to brain damage in such a way as to lead to hypoxia or anoxia in the patient." Hypoxia is lack of oxygen leading to muscle tissues, which includes the brain. Anoxia is just a fancy word for lack of oxygen. There is no way in hell Nanotrasen would want to risk getting a giant whale-sized law suit placed on their desk because a crewmember died, suffered irreparable effects, or any other of its many side effects. If you give me the argument "oh its the future wawaaawaa" This future still uses fax machines and Polaroid cameras. It still uses pens and books and newspapers, syringes, metal barriers, metal shutters, tools instead of one giant multi-tool. Its not a very advanced future.

If we really want to continue this argument, lets watch a few videos on youtube of people going into grand mal seizures or how they suddenly enter cardiac arrest, void their bowels, and die on the table? This is not a thing that should be in a game, nor should it be widely used by a company. As if word got out that Nanotrasen was using electroshock therapy, you better believe they would lose a ton of their business.

Electroconvulsive Therapy is just a poor addition to the game that will serve no purpose, but you better believe it will piss off some players. Including me.

TL;DR: A Research Station wouldn't be employing this method of practice, on its station as the only circumstances in which it can be used would disqualify a person from being on the station in the first place.

[Zundy]

Regardless of whether ECT is used/not used or ethical/not ethical, I think it's boring to have in game and with such a rich 400 year canvas available to us I think we should go with a more futuristic tech. There was mention of a machine thats would influnce brain waves and induce pleasant thoughts on a previous thread? Something along those lines would be great imo.

[Jennalele]

Zundy, all I'm hearing here is "meh fuck the facts it's neat".

And in my main post I addressed something else about CTs- Sometimes, things should be permanent for the round. Sometimes, cloning DOES go wrong, and you suddenly can't get medical to fix-all and send you away. Actions and injuries that have consequences are sorely lacking in the game, and I don't see why it's such a big ordeal. Psych is meant to be a largely RP based role. If people who play psych once in a blue moon whine and moan that there's no mechanics, they should be playing a doctor or something instead.

Mind control devices also kinda feel more in line with "antag round" than "standard psych loadout".

[Zundy]

This PR was to give the psychiatrist something to do and to be part of the medical team. I thought it was largely a welcome addition? I can sympathize with not wanting things like electro shock, but giving psychiatrists something extra seems like a noble goal to me. We still must consider gameplay throughout this as well in front of any realism, bearing in mind this is ss13 and not realistic in the slightest.

I can get behind permanent damage as I'm a "you die you die" guy as well but it's a mostly unpopular stance ¯\_(ツ)_/¯.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

We have to look at the psychologist and Chaplain role in a way that has us mix "gamey" with "realism". That goalpost is ours to put wherever we feel comfortable. On max realism we'd have to spend weeks and weeks speaking to the psychologist - or at the very least the entire 3 hour round. And I for one do not have that kind of patience. I'll willingly offer 10 minutes of my time to a psychologist for the purpose of healing my trauma and any more than that and I'll literally die in real life from boredom.

But for the specific things,

Electro-shock therapy is insane. We should not have torture and debunked fluke science presented as a valid method of dealing with trauma. This should never be implemented. If we reskin it to something sci-fi like exotic energy waves altering the neurons firing in our brains to 're-wire' it then maybe. It is beyond edgy.

Exorcisms could also be given a fresh new face. We have more religions in our game than catholocism. The xeno religions share a lot of screen time. Give the Chaplain the ability to recieve confessions, as well as do a generic multi-cultural 'ritual' in which they purify someone's soul to cure certain traumas.

Medicine for traumas is also a good base choice if there is no psych and you're short on time but going to the chaplain and psych for moderately lengthy treatments is also something with merit, but the choices made by fowl in how to execute these is straight out of a 19th century french psychiatry ward.

[TheSleepyCatmom]

I'm glad someone else sees it like I did at least.

But yeah, while I'll welcome additions to Psychiatry, I think we need more futuristic options instead of, well as Jackboot aptly put '19th century french psychiatry ward'.

If given time, myself and Aimless can come up with better options that'd make more sense to be on a space station, to treat these disorders.

I have no issue with the Chaplain being involved in some way, but exorcising mental disabilities isn't quite how I'd like that piece to go down. Since it's not quite realistic, we could always add demonic possession as a 'mental disability'. Like we have Imaginary Friends, and Split Personalities. This would give the chaplain more to do, make exorcisms actually mean something.

Medication for these traumas can also be based on real-life equivalents, if we're just treating and not curing. Otherwise, a new medication will need to be thought up.

[The Stryker]

Digging past the whole ECT, isolation, and hypnotherapy rooms, it's a bit odd for a space station to have such a large psychiatry wing, not to mention the fact that a lot of these solutions are outdated.

I think the go-to for a lot of our brain damage issues that are largely mechanical should involve surgery as like everyone's saying, electroshock in the 25th century is a bit odd. Considering we have a lot of incredibly powerful medicine, I like the idea of psychiatry being limited to surgery and temporary medicine that need to be topped up to keep the effects from happening.

That said, if we implement ECT, it should come with consequences as a little burn damage and HALLOSS seems a bit small for directly zapping someone's brain and resorting to antiquated methods should produce a lot of consequences like amnesia or such as the price of getting your arms and legs back or losing your imaginary friend.

Hypnosis is a bit kooky and if it's implemented, it should be mostly fluff.

The chaplain could be interesting if we implement cult-based brain traumas like seeing demons with the chaplain having a way of "expelling" them.

All things considered, I'm not really knowledgeable in IRL psychology so I'll leave the alternatives to those who are. Right now I think it's just about finding a balance between fluff and mechanics.

[Jennalele]

I agree with Stryker. Yet again- The idea of things that can't be cured in-round with a slap on the ass is rare. Give prescriptions some actual use. [mention]TheSleepyCatmom[/mention] and I have agreed to work on a solid alternative to Fowl's current PR.

[Sytic]

Right, I'm here to necro this thread, because hooooooooly fuck this was dumb.

We've had multiple people register logical complaints around it, and then the PR was pushed anyways, without any report here. Without any fucking reason.

That's horseshit, this whole thing is bullshit, and whoever made this PR can eat their own shit. The two things that were removed were exorcisms and electroshock therapy. Yet isolation therapy, which is essentially "the hole" but worse because you have to put up with a repeating ticking noise (Just a reminder, that's a prison punishment. Congratulations.) and completely unfounded hypnotism still exists. Both of these are stupid. Why not give the Psychologist specific access to neurosurgery and have surgery connected to fixing brain trauma, if you really want to give the Psychologist something to do as well as make it game and role-play friendly?

Because right now, you've got crystal magical chair that has no documentation or reasoning behind it, and two completely unfounded and potentially damaging ways of fixing psychological harm. How did any of this get pushed.

[Kaed]

Because right now, you've got crystal magical chair that has no documentation or reasoning behind it, and two completely unfounded and potentially damaging ways of fixing psychological harm. How did any of this get pushed.

 

Probably for the same reason that Alchemy was added, and the trauma update included a couple drugs that made you loyal or disloyal to Nanotrasen. People think it's funny to put kooky pseudoscience into the game as extra content.

I mean why put in stuff that has the potential of making hard science that works in the game setting, when you can put cheesey meme content that is hilariously soft like brie. Trololol.

[alexpkeaton]

My understanding is that Electroshock/ECT was not pushed in the April update. I main psych and it simply doesn't exist. The "therapy pod" (replacement?) was broken as of two weeks ago when I was last able to play. Despite that, I find the changes refreshing and an excellent starting point for a role that, prior to the April update, was 100% RP based. Even cerebral traumas were the domain of the surgeon.

Now, for my main reason for writing. The general discussion in this thread of ECT as a barbaric and illegal practice is simply not correct. (Note: I am an American so my perspective comes from USA regulations and practices)

Yes, it was a barbaric practice when used in equally barbaric mental hospitals of the early to mid 20th century. It was then unregulated and not as well-researched as it is today.

And, yes, officially, devices used for ECT, until recently, were classified by the US FDA at the highest risk level (Level III medical devices), requiring new ECT devices to demonstrate safety and effectiveness prior to going to market. In early 2016, the FDA considered dropping the level III requirement to the less-restrictive level II. I say "officially" because this demonstrates a disconnect between the government and mental health professionals who believe it should be more mainstream.

The fact is that the old age of mental health treatment is casting a long shadow on the ECT, which in the modern age has proven very effective in dealing with severe depression and can treat other mental illnesses as well. Carrie Fisher was a notable recipient of ECT and spoke about how it, in her judgment, got rid of her depression when nothing else worked.

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/life/fashion-beauty/carrie-fisher-electric-shock-therapy-got-rid-of-my-depression-for-good-35259729.html

 

"Oh, everything (about electric shock therapy is misconceived)," she explains to Rolling Stone magazine. "You get put to sleep when they do it. It's very easy and very effective. And it's not used as punishment by nurses in a mental hospital when you're bad, which is how its depicted in literally every movie, both contemporary and past."

 

Here's some more info about what's myth and what's fact about the modern ECT: http://www.health.com/depression/10-myths-and-facts-about-shock-therapy

The only thing that is still somewhat unknown (and I admit this is a little bit of a scary concept) is why ECT works. The brain is the final frontier of modern medicine. Breakthroughs for ending a litany of medical mysteries from chronic pain to mental illness and a million things in between are just waiting to be unlocked by researchers. If ECT is effective now in its current iteration, I can only imagine what we will be able to do in 500 years when we can (more) fully understand the brain.

In short, the concept that the ECT would have been a mismatch with realism for what 500 years from now might look like does not dovetail with current facts.

But again, I don't believe it was ever merged.

[Sytic]

My understanding is that Electroshock/ECT was not pushed in the April update. I main psych and it simply doesn't exist. The "therapy pod" (replacement?) was broken as of two weeks ago when I was last able to play. Despite that, I find the changes refreshing and an excellent starting point for a role that, prior to the April update, was 100% RP based. Even cerebral traumas were the domain of the surgeon.

Now, for my main reason for writing. The general discussion in this thread of ECT as a barbaric and illegal practice is simply not correct. (Note: I am an American so my perspective comes from USA regulations and practices)

Yes, it was a barbaric practice when used in equally barbaric mental hospitals of the early to mid 20th century. It was then unregulated and not as well-researched as it is today.

And, yes, officially, devices used for ECT, until recently, were classified by the US FDA at the highest risk level (Level III medical devices), requiring new ECT devices to demonstrate safety and effectiveness prior to going to market. In early 2016, the FDA considered dropping the level III requirement to the less-restrictive level II. I say "officially" because this demonstrates a disconnect between the government and mental health professionals who believe it should be more mainstream.

The fact is that the old age of mental health treatment is casting a long shadow on the ECT, which in the modern age has proven very effective in dealing with severe depression and can treat other mental illnesses as well. Carrie Fisher was a notable recipient of ECT and spoke about how it, in her judgment, got rid of her depression when nothing else worked.

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/life/fashion-beauty/carrie-fisher-electric-shock-therapy-got-rid-of-my-depression-for-good-35259729.html

 

"Oh, everything (about electric shock therapy is misconceived)," she explains to Rolling Stone magazine. "You get put to sleep when they do it. It's very easy and very effective. And it's not used as punishment by nurses in a mental hospital when you're bad, which is how its depicted in literally every movie, both contemporary and past."

 

Here's some more info about what's myth and what's fact about the modern ECT: http://www.health.com/depression/10-myths-and-facts-about-shock-therapy

The only thing that is still somewhat unknown (and I admit this is a little bit of a scary concept) is why ECT works. The brain is the final frontier of modern medicine. Breakthroughs for ending a litany of medical mysteries from chronic pain to mental illness and a million things in between are just waiting to be unlocked by researchers. If ECT is effective now in its current iteration, I can only imagine what we will be able to do in 500 years when we can (more) fully understand the brain.

In short, the concept that the ECT would have been a mismatch with realism for what 500 years from now might look like does not dovetail with current facts.

But again, I don't believe it was ever merged.

ECT was never merged. It was rightfully complained about and replaced with chakra, which is also debatable. The point that people have been raising is that, in this point in time, we should not be using debatable methods of psychiatric treatment. Neurology should be a hard field and actually explored further, as at this time it would have been a much more developed field, especially in regards to fixing trauma. Take away the Surgeon's ability to do brain surgery, rebrand the Psychologist to something different and give it the RP elements of psychiatry with the gamey elements of neurosurgery, which is a hard science. This is a leading field in fixing already existing traumas, so why are we looking at bringing in things that are debatable at best, and psychologically damaging (e.g. isolation) at worst? And why not talk about it, in the discussion thread linked into the fucking PR by someone else?

[Sytic]

Hey, hello, I'm back again.

A few weeks and limited responses, seems like this was swept under the rug. I still don't understand any of this PR, or how it got merged considering there was no mention of it being pushed on the actual linked discussion thread, nor was a rework of psychology ever proposed outside of a thread made to deliberately complain about it.

Psychology is a roleplay field, and it was always intended to be. I'm all for introducing some gamey elements to Psychology, but we can do better than scarring isolation therapy, debatable chakra therapy, and hypnosis. What happened to Psychology being one of the more serious fields of medical science? Why don't we introduce an actual hard science, such as neurology into psychology, if we want to make Psychologists more important?

I don't understand.

[Bauser]

It would be interesting if there was a way to make it so that actually talking to the psychiatrist cured some traumas (or phobias at least). Mechanically enforcing roleplay.

As an aside, an opinion that has been expressed many times in this thread and should be repeated until consensus is reached: ECT and isolation therapy are dumb and shouldn't be part of psych's arsenal. It would be easy to come up with a new treatment that is mechanically similar to ECT without any of the real-world connotations (specifically, the one where it doesn't work and is basically just torture).

Personally, I would love to see the implementation of a psych test like the one shown in Blade Runner 2049.. A battery of challenge phrases where the patient responds and the psychiatrist finds their trauma by analzing those responses. Bonus points if it gets its own testing room with shiny white floors and a high-tech camera that tracks their eye and lip movements to read their subconscious. Though since traumas aren't actually hard to diagnose in-game, this could be a curative process instead of a diagnostic one.

EDIT:

WHEN YOU'RE NOT PERFORMING YOUR DUTIES, DO THEY KEEP YOU IN A LITTLE BOX? CELLS. INTERLINKED. WHAT'S IT LIKE TO HOLD THE HAND OF SOMEONE YOU LOVE? INTERLINKED. DO THEY TEACH YOU HOW TO FEEL FINGER-TO-FINGER? INTERLINKED. DO YOU LONG FOR HAVING YOUR HEART INTERLINKED? INTERLINKED. DO YOU DREAM ABOUT BEING INTERLINKED? WHAT'S IT LIKE TO HOLD YOUR CHILD IN YOUR ARMS? INTERLINKED. DO YOU FEEL THAT THERE'S A PART OF YOU THAT'S MISSING? INTERLINKED. WITHIN CELLS INTERLINKED. WHY DON'T YOU SAY THAT THREE TIMES. WITHIN CELLS INTERLINKED.

[Skull132]

It would be interesting if there was a way to make it so that actually talking to the psychiatrist cured some traumas (or phobias at least). Mechanically enforcing roleplay.

 

The unfortunate thing is that this is nearly impossible.

For a curing mechanic, I did slowly start thinking of having traumas be associated with certain words and situations. And then allowing the psychiatrist to monitor the patient's reaction as he goes through possible links. Like, let's say you gain a trauma from oxygen deprivation. At the moment you gain it, it does a quick scan of your character and retains oxygen damage and lung damage as a "trigger". You'd have the trauma as normal, but whenever events associated with the trigger arise, the trauma would get momentarily worse/other effects would arise. If we could give the psychiatrist ways to monitor this, and then uh, somehow cure it. Then idk it'd be neat.

But note how I'm missing the "cure" bit. And even without that, what I described is a relatively complex system.

[mention]Sytic[/mention] To answer your question. With traumas being mechanical in nature now, it does not make sense to keep Psychiatrist as a "purely RP" role. They need an ability to cure the traumas somehow, point one. Point two, the presence of these mechanics is not somehow subtracting from the roleplay of being a psychiatrist. It's simply giving a mechanical core to the role, around which you can do literally whatever type of roleplay you want.

As for the nature of the mechanics. I do agree that some of the mechanics are questionable. But there's a hitch with thinking up scientific ones. The problem is that traumas, in reality, do require soft power. However, as illustrated above, coding soft power is literally impossible. So at some point, you need to have a magical, mechanical switch which deletes the trauma for you. It's just a matter of figuring out where to bury said switch, and how. If you've got detailed ideas, I'd be more than open to listening to them.

[Sytic]

There have been two given possible solutions, one of which was part of the code originally quite easily, I agree, traumas require mechanical ways of going about it- but using debatable methods of therapy isn't. Here's two much more scientific fields, which would almost definitely be explored as a field of medical science in the far future.

Chemistry and You: The Psychiatrist's Method of Knowing How to Manage Your Shit Correctly

Traumas fuck with the brain, that's for sure. Traumas can cause chemical imbalances and completely and utterly fuck your mental hormones up sideways, absolutely screwing with your mental pathways. For this, a controlled dose of prescribed chemicals can be used as a prescription basis to correctly balance you out. How this system would work is as follows:

1: Change the current chakra stuff to a trauma detection lounge. Keep it simple, but essentially give it a readout of how severe each trauma is in comparison to each other.

2: Using the given readout, you can find the required amount of units for each dose.

3: Forward the required prescription to the chemist. They'll make the stuff.

4: The patient takes the required prescription and their trauma is cleared. Mental damage starts ticking if the Chemist or the Psychologist screwed the pooch.

5: The dose is only required (preferably) once per round, although once per two hours can be a thing (if you really want it to). Effectively, it's a method to erase the trauma. Check against the right amount of prescription, yes, remove it.

I have no idea how easy or difficult that is to code, but it was a system requested far earlier in this thread, and I'm okay with that. Unlike all the advertised and implemented changes the PR proposed for the Psychologist, this is a field currently in development and is constantly being advanced as a medical science, along with my second suggestion...

Neurology and You: Why Needles in Your Brain Isn't Always Bad

If Trauma's fuck with the brain, the Neurologist is the pest control for insanity. Rebrand the Psychologist to the Neurologist (as the fields overlap in places and Psychiatric knowledge would be important for the roleplayed aftereffects of dealing with post-trauma) and give it a surgery table. Surgeons are no longer accomplished brain surgeons outside of painfully lobotomising someone's brain, while the Neurologist uses their advanced medical science to nip those traumas in the bud.

Effectively, like the same trauma-removal system we had before, just shunting it off to the now Neurologist instead of the Surgeons, who already have way too much on their plate as is, in hectic rounds. This system would allow for cloning to be effective regardless of whether the Surgeon is around or not, and allow trauma care to happen across the board of the round. This also develops the Psychiatrist's medical know-how and makes them feel involved as part of Medical.

Hopefully, this seems good. Even though I suck at suggestions, and typically screw up my words, I hope this was good to read. Let me know what you think, [mention]Skull132[/mention].