ben10083 Posted November 13, 2018 Posted November 13, 2018 Idea Remove Ion Rifle (and subsequently the locker holding it) from Armory Why Ion Rifle is a massive thorn in the side of any antag synthetic Way too easy to possess such a powerful weapon Ends fights in one shot, ends the round for synethics in two Forces synthetic antags to be defensive or face a quick death Other reasons I have forgotten to mention How This Will Change Rounds Security will need to either buy an ion rifle from cargo or get one from RnD (Not sure if RnD can make one, but you get the gist) Buys time for synthetic antags to prepare if sec tries to get one Forces security to try other tactics instead of just running up to the synthetic with an ion Allows more freedom for synthetic antags Likely Arguments (And Counter-Argument) "Malf Rounds Will Become Too Powerful" - Borgs are still physically weak and can be trapped easily, it will just be harder instead of being dumpstered on by Ions "Ninja Will be Unstoppable" - Ion Rifle can still be obtained via cargo (and maybe RnD) Conclusion I feel that this change will allow for more dynamic rounds with synthetic antags and giving them a meaningful chance, but sec can still get an Ion Rifle if it orders one.
VTCobaltblood Posted November 13, 2018 Posted November 13, 2018 RnD can produce ion laser modulators, with which you can potentially create an ion weapon better than the usual ion rifle. However, they need a material shipment and someone who knows how to make guns - they can't just print a ready ion rifle, they need to assemble their own laser weapon which will fire an ion beam.
Itanimulli Posted November 13, 2018 Posted November 13, 2018 I really can't believe I'm about to argue against this, but.... The ion is used for: -Anti-hardsuit -Anti-mech -Anti-Ipc -Anti-people-with-mechanical-limbs -shutting down lasers -PROVIDING RAPID RESPONSE TO SYNTHETIC OR ELECTRONIC THREATS IM GENERAL. The primary concerns seem to be getting shut-down in rounds where you'd have not been if sec didn't have the Ion rifle in the first place. As memey as it may sound, one needs to get good or suck it up. We all know the many metric fucktons of salt Noir caused when they were antag or going against them. We really don't need rounds that end up having a decent player robust a bunch of unrobust sec officers only for people to swarm the forums with "nurf ipc they bad." Learn from the past. A glaring wekness is very important.
Kaed Posted November 13, 2018 Posted November 13, 2018 No. Synthetics have a plethora of strengths over everyone else, making their primary weakness harder to acquire just is an indirect buff for synthetics. They don't need it, nor do they deserve it. Ninjas even have tools to mitigate emp blasts already.
Butterrobber202 Posted November 13, 2018 Posted November 13, 2018 At the above posts, While Synthetics do have some advantages over most races, that doesn’t justify Sec having a one shot kill weapon for them. I’d fully support removing the Ion Rifle from the Armory.
geeves Posted November 13, 2018 Posted November 13, 2018 Instead of removing the Ion rifle, as it's overall called a "one-shot" weapon, much like headgibbing slugs are, why not just bring it in line with the damage output of things like laser rifles to Vaurca? The rate at which ions drain stuff is pretty memey.
FreshRefreshments Posted November 13, 2018 Posted November 13, 2018 Id be all for lowering the two shot drain em and slain em of Ions, at least for IPCs and maybe borgs, with Geeve's answer of on par with a laser rifle, which, for unarmored targets, still deals plenty of damage. Maybe even ghetto armor that Synthetics can get to give a chance of an Ion failing to do any damage for the shot? Removing the ion entirely sounds excessive, though.
Yonnimer Posted November 13, 2018 Posted November 13, 2018 One counter could be to add a “stun” mode which can knock ipcs out, and disable cybernetics for a minute or so.
Itanimulli Posted November 13, 2018 Posted November 13, 2018 Just have it's hits set the battery to the point whete you end up on the 30-second emergency power mode. It's a full 30 second stun. It's battery related. Let it happen.
kyres1 Posted November 13, 2018 Posted November 13, 2018 Not really a good idea as it stands. Making mechs immune to it sounds fine on paper because they're advanced combat vehicles and meant to be super duper overpowered. For playable races we are presently attempting, albeit very poorly, to maintain ""balance"" to some degree. Everything has some weakness, and things like Vaurca or IPCs who have massive amounts of buffs have glaring weaknesses such as instant kill magic blue guns or lasers/toxins. Do I think the ion's silly? Yes. But until we get more creative counters to IPCs beyond it just being lasers, ions and EMP, (or make all races equally OP) they need to stay. A good idea would be making ions a long stun like previously proposed so they're a way to slow down or otherwise incapacitate mechs/IPCs/synths long enough for other methods of murder to be employed, instead of an outright "lol ur ded" instant kill. Speaking of which, I'll make a separate suggestion thread for just that.
ben10083 Posted November 13, 2018 Author Posted November 13, 2018 This topic has gone off topic, it isnt about removing ion rifle, but removing it from armory, aka making it harder for sec to have it.
tbear13 Posted November 13, 2018 Posted November 13, 2018 Not a fan of this idea. It really limits security's options when it comes to dealing with IPCs. An IPC with nanopaste can soak up a lot of lasers and easily keep fighting. Security's only real options would be to wait 10 minutes for one rifle, which takes 60% of their department funds, or fight the IPC anyway, and probably take a fair amount of casualties themselves. Maybe just give borgs some EMP resistance instead? I don't see an issue with the ion rifle as it is right now, personally.
Arrow768 Posted November 14, 2018 Posted November 14, 2018 Each species we have has certain advantages and disadvantages. And different species is more or less suitable for certain play-styles. As a IPC, it is much harder to play an offensive and highly visible antagonist than it is with a Unathi. But if you choose to play offensively as a IPC, then you have to accept the obvious choice that security is going to get the ion rifle. The alternative to this is quite simple. Alter your playstyle. Choose a stealthier and more subtle approach that will not give away who the antagonist is. For example by utilizing bombs in strategic locations or bio-weapons or explosive implants to force others to do your bidding. Or you could just remove the single ion rifle from the armory As mentioned by [mention]Itanimulli[/mention] the ion rifle has a very wide variety of other uses than to take down IPCs. It would be unreasonable to remove the ion rifle from the armory when there is a very wide range of situations where the usage of the ion rifle is applicable. Since we have another suggestion that aims to rework the interactions of IPC with the ion rifle, I am voting on dismissal here.
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