Feedback for Animal Control #14173

[Kintsugi]

This thread has been created as required by PR #14173 (Animal Control) https://github.com/Aurorastation/Aurora.3/pull/14173

Edited June 7, 2022 by Arrow768
Updated the Title and body so its a bit clearer what this is about.

[Roostercat]

I don't really see a reason to do this. It just removes stuff because one person doesn't like it. The pets are fine, and can bring RP pretty often. -1

[Faye <3]

The pets are cute, I would be sad to see them go. -1

 

Though I wouldn't mind Columbo's spaghetticode being fixed, haha.

[SinfulBehaviors]

Absolutely not. People actually really like the pets, it doesn't matter if you think it doesn't add to the game. Like, I've never seen a round when the CE lets Ginny out where people aren't in love with having her around or wanting to take care of her. Regardless, to actually address your reasons:

• Columbo is genuinely broken

Then fix him, or suggest for someone else to do it.

• Ginny is hostile wildlife

This is a trope that is absurdly common in fiction where people keep otherwise hostile creatures as pets. She's a baby who's being cared for by humans. This is a thing that happens in actual life with otherwise hostile animals.

• Foxes are not pets

They literally can be in the modern day, let alone in the future.

• Ian is ugly

I say again, fix him or get someone else to do it.

• They are constantly killed by airlocks

Then make the doors recognize simple mobs so it doesn't crush them if you have such an issue with it.

• or minor changes in the atmosphere

So what? Animals usually aren't super receptive to the air getting sucked out of a location, even briefly.

• or being clicked with the wrong item.

Brother, I've stabbed people on accident by clicking wrong. That's not an issue of pets, that's just a common issue.

 

Is it really too immersion breaking to have them here? Are they really so commonly annoying that it ruins rounds? You don't have to like every feature, but to get rid of them entirely based entirely on your minority opinion would just suck.

[Zelmana]

Columbo should remain.

Oh and, uh, one more thing- he should get his rightful rank of 2nd Lieutenant back.

[Kintsugi]

4 hours ago, SinfulBehaviors said:

-snip-

>Then fix him, or suggest for someone else to do it.

No. "Improve not remove" is not a valid reply. If you want it improved or fixed, it's up to you to code that, not me.

>This is a trope that is absurdly common in fiction where people keep otherwise hostile creatures as pets. She's a baby who's being cared for by humans. This is a thing that happens in actual life with otherwise hostile animals.

I don't really care if it's a fiction trope. Fiction tropes don't guide design.

>They literally can be in the modern day, let alone in the future.

Science experiment in Russia. Frankly, I don't care if there are a few supposedly domesticated foxes somewhere in Siberia - dancing bears aren't okay for the station, either.

>I say again, fix him or get someone else to do it.

No. "Improve not remove" is not a valid reply. If you want it improved or fixed, it's up to you to code that, not me.

Edited June 8, 2022 by DanseMacabre

[Sheeplets]

The fact that your only counter-argument is that you "don't care" is enough of a reason for me to want them to stay.

-1, not everything needs to be sanitized.

[Zelmana]

2 hours ago, DanseMacabre said:

 

No. "Improve not remove" is not a valid reply. If you want it improved or fixed, do it yourself. I have no interest in doing so.

 

Says who?

Improve not remove is a valid reply. Because I said so.

[Boggle08]

I see these things used by the crew all the time. The only "pet"(if it's still even here) worth removing is the hivebot locked away in the RD's office. No one messes with that guy. Maybe pun-pun too, because at least half of all barkeeps I see just seal him away or animal abuse him. He just gets in the way.

The rest are way too useful to let go. The silly animals bring characters together ICly, and facilitate interaction thanks to it.

 

[Marlon P.]

What a mean spirited suggestion and a dismissive attitude by OP. Also wow youre so hostile to the animals in the pr. Calm down dude lol.

Bad idea.

-1.

Edited June 8, 2022 by Marlon P.

[EJJ]

32 minutes ago, Boggle08 said:

I see these things used by the crew all the time. The only "pet"(if it's still even here) worth removing is the hivebot locked away in the RD's office. No one messes with that guy. Maybe pun-pun too, because at least half of all barkeeps I see just seal him away or animal abuse him. He just gets in the way.

The rest are way too useful to let go. The silly animals bring characters together ICly, and facilitate interaction thanks to it.

 

I can agree with removing Pun Pun or maybe just replacing Pun Pun with a wholly different animal. Half the time it ends up kidnapped by a vamp or thrown somewhere and never seen again. Additionally on Aurora I'd see Pun Pun buckled to a chair 9/10 times somewhere out of the way. On most Horizon rounds I don't even really see Pun Pun taken out of the bartender's closet.
I remember the hivebot in RD on Aurora but I don't think it got brought over to the Horizon. Unless it's somewhere other than the RD's office.

Generally I think it'd be more interesting to add more functionality to pets, especially the Command pets but OP seems set on just removing them.

Edited June 8, 2022 by EJJ

[stev]

44 minutes ago, EJJ said:

I can agree with removing Pun Pun or maybe just replacing Pun Pun with a wholly different animal. Half the time it ends up kidnapped by a vamp or thrown somewhere and never seen again. Additionally on Aurora I'd see Pun Pun buckled to a chair 9/10 times somewhere out of the way. On most Horizon rounds I don't even really see Pun Pun taken out of the bartender's closet.
I remember the hivebot in RD on Aurora but I don't think it got brought over to the Horizon. Unless it's somewhere other than the RD's office.

Generally I think it'd be more interesting to add more functionality to pets, especially the Command pets but OP seems set on just removing them.

Unironically? Replace Pun Pun with a Schlorrgo.

[Chada1]

5 hours ago, DanseMacabre said:

>They literally can be in the modern day, let alone in the future.

Science experiment in Russia. Frankly, I don't care if there are a few supposedly domesticated foxes somewhere in Siberia - dancing bears aren't okay for the station, either.

It started in Russia but it didn't end there, there are domestic fox farms in multiple places, especially in Ontario, Canada, right now. I didn't know this when we had our conversation a day or so ago, but yeah it's a thing. Domestic foxes aren't just in Siberia/Russia.

The new domestic fox breed that can be found around the world is part of the Vulpes Vulpes class, which makes them almost identical to regular foxes, except with the domestic gene. The siberian ones were a different breed of fox entirely.

The reason these domestic Vulpes Vulpes foxes ran under my radar is because they descend from the worldwide Fur trade, and dark immoral industries like that I don't tend to delve into.

Edited June 8, 2022 by Chada1

[Caelphon]

I don't really care for the pets, nor do I care enough to fight for them to remain. I'm ambivalent. 

I do, however, think that there is a degree of hostility by a few people here, and that should be toned down significantly. The  onus is on the individual wishing for something to be improved, and not for the one suggesting its removal. Either you can use your own skills, or use the skills of another. Otherwise it isn't really a valid explaination for something, we've seen this throughout the server's history: Wizard, Changeling, Vampire, AI. The list goes on. If you want something improved, it is up to you to do something about it. I think forcing someone who wishes to remove it to instead improve upon something is a weird way to address this situation, and their opinion. 

[Zelmana]

3 hours ago, Caelphon said:

I don't really care for the pets, nor do I care enough to fight for them to remain. I'm ambivalent. 

I do, however, think that there is a degree of hostility by a few people here, and that should be toned down significantly. The  onus is on the individual wishing for something to be improved, and not for the one suggesting its removal. Either you can use your own skills, or use the skills of another. Otherwise it isn't really a valid explaination for something, we've seen this throughout the server's history: Wizard, Changeling, Vampire, AI. The list goes on. If you want something improved, it is up to you to do something about it. I think forcing someone who wishes to remove it to instead improve upon something is a weird way to address this situation, and their opinion. 

Hostility is a two way street and the tone of Danse recently is something lately. Not rule breaking, unless you factor in the "don't be a dick" rule but I've offended on that in more than one occasion.

[DeadLantern]

Columbo is pretty broken. He bites people randomly. That I agree with.

I don't know why you're on the warpath for all the other animals though? You say the cat is fine--but the dog is not allowed because... It is ugly? It's a pet. I doubt Crusher is catching many nice anyways, nevermind the fact dogs can do the same. They are there recreationally, as a mascot. Ginny is a baby and I think, genetically modified to stay that way. Calling her "hostile wildlife" is absurd and needlessly provocative. Foxes can certainly be pet 400 years in the future with genetic modification.

Danse, what is the reason for removing all others besides Crusher? Is it because you find them immersion breaking? These are not golems who literally are designed to cause chaos by the wanton actions of players. They are animals that sit and look cute. What's the big deal, honestly? Would anyone's game be improved that much to warrant their removal? I think most people are neutral about the pets to liking them because they're cute. How many people want to remove them, truly?

[Kintsugi]

I closed the PR. At the end of the day, regardless of my personal feelings, any change with public opinion so decisively against it as this one just isn't a good idea and shouldn't be pursued.

[Chada1]

Even if the PR is closed or you decide not to keep it up to see where it goes, if you have any ideas that could help you enjoy pets in the game more, this thread could still be useful, this is true of anyone else here too, and it wouldn't persay be you doing all of the coding, there does seem to be some interest from multiple people here for adding/removing/changing some.

 

Also, you weren't wrong for making a PR to remove something you don't like, that's perfectly understandable, and noone should fault you with that. I've done the same thing and stepped back when public sentiment was fervently against it, it's actually not a bad thing to do at all and shows you care about others people enjoyment of the game too.

Edited June 8, 2022 by Chada1

[SinfulBehaviors]

9 hours ago, Caelphon said:

I don't really care for the pets, nor do I care enough to fight for them to remain. I'm ambivalent. 

I do, however, think that there is a degree of hostility by a few people here, and that should be toned down significantly. The  onus is on the individual wishing for something to be improved, and not for the one suggesting its removal. Either you can use your own skills, or use the skills of another. Otherwise it isn't really a valid explaination for something, we've seen this throughout the server's history: Wizard, Changeling, Vampire, AI. The list goes on. If you want something improved, it is up to you to do something about it. I think forcing someone who wishes to remove it to instead improve upon something is a weird way to address this situation, and their opinion. 

The thing is that I don't have a problem with the pets, most people don't. I wasn't even aware that Columbo is broken because I rarely play sec. The issue I have is that calling for a total removal instead of figuring out how to fix it isn't the way to go. If your concern is "Columbo is biting people randomly" or "Ian is ugly" then why is the first answer to delete it?

[MattAtlas]

Locking this as the PR has been closed.