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[1 dismissal] Let xenos species and synths speak SOL.


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What the title says. Allow synths and xeno species to speak SOL common.

There does not seem to be a reason in lore they cannot, at least with most xenos species. It would also would fix the problem of IPCs from SOL not speaking SOL.

EDIT: separating this into two suggestions, other suggestion focusing more on ipcs

https://forums.aurorastation.org/topic/11995-allow-ipcs-to-speak-more-languages/

Edited by Yonnimer
adding the new suggestion to split this
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Yeah but humans shouldn't get to be as special as all the others.  Did they go through a whitelist to get to play?  No, they just got their language handed to them in a small loan of a less than million years of culture in this sci-fi setting.

Also, as the primary species of the server, there is more reason for the xenos to learn their languages for better communication, and the station isn't even IN the sol system, so most crewmembers would have had to learn it anyway.

Edited by Kaed
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The only argument I've seen against a xeno or two being able to know is that "if the xenos can learn that, why can't humans be able to learn theirs". I don't see the point in having arbitrary things that make no sense ICly. Yes, a Unathi, Tajaran, or Vaurca may be unable to talk in Sol Common correctly (especially Vaurcae since their speech is fucked up), but then you get to the Skrell who can pronounce things on a higher sound spectrum humans can't fathom...and they can't speak this language that's super low in comparison?

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As per the last time this was suggested, I still don't understand this restriction. For some characters, it makes no sense that they cannot understand Sol. Whether you can physically speak a language does not impact being able to understand it. It's a big hole, immersion-wise, when an IPC or Skrell that was created or has spent years in Sol can't understand "Hello" only for the arbitrary restriction of "But humans need their own language" (Unathi get two. Does that mean every species now get two unique languages? Don't even get me started on Tajara!) and "if an alien knows the language it means humans aren't good." It sounds just... really odd to me. Like saying Japan and Japanese people are the only people who should know Japanese. Anyone else learning Japanese takes away from their cultural identity. It's a language. It's meant to be shared. Just like food, just like music. But this suggestion won't ever go through as-is, because humans need their own language. (Forget the fact many humans don't know Sol either, because ICly they would have no reason to know it. Don't worry about it. It's fine if it's the opposite way.)

 

What was once brought up was the idea of implants that will let you know a language. Perhaps the idea of an intermediate language similar to how Siik'Tau works. Or maybe how stationbounds can understand a language but not speak it.

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If xenos can't speak it due to some difference with it and basic, then that's fine. Just maybe a little blurb of that on the language page. It is only slightly implied on the basic paragraph with "Its unique, fully customized alphabet and structure allow it to be spoken even by most alien species.". Nothing on the SOL common one.

The bigger issue is the fact IPCs can not. As they should technically be able to, besides just "it's the human language", which is just a restriction, not lore. Which if there was a reason in lore they couldn't, then it could possibly be fine, if done well. But as far as I can tell, there is not currently.

Edited by Yonnimer
added a bit more.
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I also support this. Firstly, there is no reason for Tajara to not be able to speak slurred Sol Common if they can speak TCB, Freespeak and Tradeband, which are all human languages of various origins. Secondly, I also think that the "each species gets a unique language" is a pretty silly restriction. The "their mouths can't pronounce it" stops working when you're dealing with IPCs, since they can transmit any sounds - possibly even sounds humans cannot hear. Lorewise, it does not make sense - and I'd much rather have consistent lore than racial identity or whatever.

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Guest Marlon Phoenix

All identity is arbitrary but we will not be deconstructing it because it sets a precedent for all to know all languages.

 

We have a human language aliens can speak. Tau ceti basic is a human language all learn.

Sol common is a foreign language from a human nation.

Alliance diplomats and xeno diplomats to them speak basic to each other.

Edited by Marlon Phoenix
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Languages don't work that way, however. It gives you "identity" in a loose sense of the term, but SHARING your language doesn't take away the identity it gives you. Really, what sets everyone apart is accents. The dialect a region uses and the phrases we use daily. I'm from Alabama. I confuse my Floridian friend all the time when I use "southern slang". This is true for many regions of the world. It's safe to say Solarian is going through the same thing. I'm sure Martians have slang that those living on Luna just shake their head at in confusion. Yes, the words can be understood, but do they mean anything to you?

Solarians don't get their identity from their language: They get it from their culture as a whole. Sharing bits and pieces of your culture doesn't make you any less special. Unless speaking Solarian somehow makes you develop the Solarian accent, understand the Solarian culture, start eating Solarian foods and forces you to move to Luna.....

All the languages are foreign. ALL of them. Basic (and yes, I'm fully aware it has it's own alphabet and grammar) still probably carries hints of Sol in it, due to the fact that Ceti itself is so close to Sol and was under Sol's thumb for quite a while. It kinda feels like the English of the future. I don't mean it sounds like English, but more that it's a melting pot that robs languages of words and phrases, jumbles them up in it's own alphabet, and spits it back out in such a "familiar" way that people can easily pick up on it. It'd explain why so many aliens can pick up Basic (even if their grasp of it is well.. basic!)

Also: Saying "Well it gives the Solarians identity" still doesn't explain why Solarian IPC's can't speak Sol.

What I'm trying to get across is: Having a "special language" isn't what sets the characters apart. It isn't what gives Solarians their "identity". Sharing the language doesn't, in any way, rip something from Sol. Letting some filthy cat Tajaran slurr out Sol and butcher it isn't going to rob my character of her identity.

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While I'm ambivalent on the other species, for IPCs it's pretty weird that they can't know Sol Common, given that like 99% of them will have been created in Sol space for use in Sol space; it seems weird that they'd be restricted from learning the native language of their creators, especially since that'd make them a less competitive AI product than, say, Space Alexa, if you have to learn a new language to even use what you've bought.

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4 hours ago, nicemoreoften said:

taking that away from only humans is a mechanical disadvantage they don't really need for some slight lore consistency that could be fixed with a blurb about mouthshapes or whatever.

Not letting IPCs speak Sol Common is damaging lore consistency for some slight mechanical advantage that already can be nullified by someone basically just getting their hands on a circuit kit.

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I'd support IPCs being able to select any language as part of their programming, given they can basically just download it. It is annoying that Ranger, who was owned by the SolGov Marines for 80 percent of her lifespan, can't speak Sol common. I can't imagine they'd make everyone else learn another language to interact with her for that time, so did they just forcibly wipe the Sol Common language database when they sold her to NT? 

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I'm perfectly fine with IPCs being able to speak common, but other xenos should not be able to speak it. I would be fine with a siik'tau-esque version of solcom, but xenos being able to speak languages that have been designed for human mouths and vocal chords, but humans not being able to speak the xenos' language is kind of ridiculous to me.

I know that Skrell and Tajaran languages require things that humans are unable to do, but what's stopping them from speaking the Unathi's languages?

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20 hours ago, VTCobaltblood said:

Not letting IPCs speak Sol Common is damaging lore consistency for some slight mechanical advantage that already can be nullified by someone basically just getting their hands on a circuit kit.

Have we not already established that IPCs can switch certain parts of themselves out with assistance? 

why would a IPC in Tau Ceti waste storage space on a language that isn’t used in the system it’s in

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3 minutes ago, Butterrobber202 said:

Have we not already established that IPCs can switch certain parts of themselves out with assistance? 

why would a IPC in Tau Ceti waste storage space on a language that isn’t used in the system it’s in

A few reasons I’d imagine. They could have a owner who would rather speak sol then basic, if they both came from sol.

Plus, if that was the reason they didn’t. Why would ipcs speak freespeak or tradeband?

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I am severely opposed to opening up sol common to other xenos.
The same reason why humans cant speak the xeno language can as easily apply to them aswell.

IPCs are a bigger question.
Opening them up just for Sol Common is also a nogo.

One option that might be possible would be to allow them to use all verbal and non-verbal languages if it is just a matter of downloading the correct language.
However that is something for a different suggestion as this suggestion aims to only give them and all other xenos sol common.

For the reasons outlined above, I am voting for dismissal.

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