Coalf

Well alright, it just seems a bit inconsistent to berate people for the same thing in the comments. But I'll keep the guideline in mind for later when it pops up.

Well isn't that a bit hypocritical to ask people to act civil yet letting developers respond with however aggressive comments they want in their commit names? I think this is a case-by-case thing and it should certainly be taken care of in this instance.

Schev would be right about moderation. I just think it's very unwholesome to make commits with names such as these to avoid the "Don't shitpost in the comments" rule.

I don't know why there is a debate Jackboot said he doesn't want to do it and wage gaps are fully in the field of lore, not development. If he said there ain't one, there ain't one and that's that. Also holy hell this would horribly cripple Vaurca with the "Neuter" tag because they would be BARELY able to purchase ANYTHING from the K'ois vendors and plenty of vaurca rely on those in deadhour rounds to even survive. This would be a horrible commit. - 1

1. They spawn with the RIGs. They will probably be acquired from cargo seeing as they're meant to be widespread. 2. Yes, and this is probably going to be reflected in mechanics. 3. Them spawning as normal Humans could be done if it were a disability, as disabilities are removed upon cloning. EDIT: I was forced to change my message at gunpoint by Kyres.

I agreed I made an unfair assumption and I do apologize for upsetting you with that comment, It was perhaps too far. But my explanation has nothing to do with it being common or uncommon but how hard it would be to re-integrate spacers into daily living conditions over the 50 something years. Before we start another pointless fight, define "gameplay bloat" so I don't make more assumptions. Addendum: This is why we made a feedback thread, we're going to take the points you have raised about lore so far and their presence and work on it more.

I appreciate taking the half hour to find a dictionary, but now I see where I made an assumption we didn't connect on. There were many spacers, they lived in places with low-gravity for a very long time. These spacers live there, big communities very connected. Artificial gravity is invented, but putting them on these stations is a health risk to these people. So they have these exoskeletons, the thing is reverting this strange adaptation would perhaps never be possible and they would be stuck in these skeletons for the rest of their life. Thus giving birth in normal gravity or even c-section would be extremely hard to accomplish for the woman. As we know, people refuse to move states for much smaller things. So logically, these spacers keep raising their kids on the stations, because that was the best way for those kids to stay connected to their parents and for their parents to live comfortably. They lived there whole centuries so the assumptions that all the ships are shitholes would most likely be incorrect. This is also why it mentions that people are having a surge of migrating for a job. Sure, some would perhaps start leaving or sending their kids away, but the relative amount of spacers would remain the same. No new gameplay is being introduced. They're getting a RIG, we have those. The stat increases/decreases are not very skill intensive. I really do not see your point on this repeated "Bloat". EDIT: Removed the last part, it was unnecessary.

All of the described mechanical differences would not fit under the disability menu and the main goal was to provide some variety to humans and recycle the spacer bodies already present. Correction: I was told it might be possible by a developer, so I retract my first above statement but the second still applies.

Strange, I quite remember you said " Then why are more spacers being born now that there is artificial gravity? ", not, "Why so many at ALL". To answer that question, because we have gone over 300 years without artificial gravity and our universe has a disproportionate amount of humans since forever. Spacers were already present in the code for a good year, something already inside the server can't be bloat. We have recycled something we have been provided and actually fleshed it out if anything this is saving space not bloating. I don't believe there is an established "Norm" for "Required mechanics" to add sub-species, as some sub-species are just separated by being slightly faster, tougher or just by being able to walk without a plasma tank. Thus I don't believe that stance is justified.

If you would direct your gaze to what Kyres wrote and read it instead of looking at it, you'd read this: "The offworlders on board NanoTrasen stations are not a new introduction, but higher gravity stations have recently began to see workers descending from zero-gravity environments. This is due to the recent proliferation of the unique ESS modules thanks to NanoTrasen’s mass distribution of them to workers seeking alternative job routes. These ESS, or Exo-Stellar Skeleton modules, are RIG-like exoskeletons that assist in movement and comfort in a standard gravity environment. Though old inventions, their recent mass upgrades from NT has allowed them to meet health and safety standards for comfortable work, and has sparked a large immigration back into the Core Worlds from these afflicted Humans." Which answers your first question. "Why so many now?" To answer your second question: "Why are there no xeno low gravs?" We feel this is unnecessary bloat. Spacers have been already present in the code long before, and if all our ideas would boil down to "the species but it gets the spacer suit", it would be redundant. You are however free to code, sprite and suggest these variations if your heart desires but I feel those will be rejected due to being bloat. We do have the Lore Request forum. Regarding: "Mechanics" If you consider all of the additions that have been suggested as "not enough", then I simply can't help you. If you feel like you're being robbed of vital mechanics, you're free to offer or make more. We are looking forward to the solutions suggested by people. Regarding: "Factions" Spacers, as seen above, are only a representative faction. You are 100% allowed to make them from any faction you please, with your own twists and turns on them! This is why they're remaining un-whitelisted.

All the issues that come with Off-Worlders come with Spacers. 1) Characters already call themselves spacers. 2) They're not just in space, they're from low-grav planets. 3) Spacers is technically everyone who lives in space.

Third addendum, yaaay! Technically both Spacers and Off-worlders is incorrect as these people CAN be from very low-grav planets, moons, and asteroids.

Oh! And a thing I forgot. You don't have to be the "species spacer" to be a "spacer". These are genetically changed humans, you could call them a genetic offshoot similar to how a dog is not a wolf. You can just as easily make a spacer that isn't from the species, it simply means he isn't the "5th generation no-grav human", he simply is the first generation or his parents never lived in no grav for such prolonged periods of time. Just like people can make an IPC and say they're from Bishop without using the Bishop sub-type.

On Matters of "Bloat" Hello, I worked on large part of the lore with Kyres and co-oped space-humans, whatever the name is now that people are upset over it, so I'll answer a few questions. But first I'd like to ask what "Bloat" means as it has been thrown quite a lot without any actual definition. Code bloat? Well no, Grav-Adapted-Humans, Shadowpeople, and Resomi are all spawnable already and have their own mechanics so I'd guess that is incorrect, after all, we're adding a hardsuit and changing properties of a species that was already there. Although it is true that people should give more thought before they vote or code new things to implement. Lore bloat? Frankly, I partially agree that the spacers shouldn't have been propped up as a big faction and I raised my concern over it with Kyres and asked at the beginning of the project when I began writing the lore for them. Character bloat? Well judging by the people here everyone is a big boy pant veteran and I think that harms the view of how people approach the server. Sure it "Doesn't have to be" mechanical, but as Ornias said: " But she can already make whatever character she wants to make within the human subfactions without having to be backed up by a RIGsuit. " Yep and plenty of people can't because they are not as good as Sleepy. I live in a world of idealism and in that world, mechanics serve to boost Roleplaying capabilities, both of those experienced and those inexperienced. I believe spacers are a door for people who have not even considered the possibility of being a weird genetic freak, which leads to my second topic. On Matters of "There Be Elves In Them Hills" Nein would be incorrect, the person was originally not scorned over having "elf ears", but over the fact, they claimed to be a literal elf. I was there during the debate. On Matters of "Off-Worlders" My idea was to call them Spacies so I could tell them to get off of my station, reee. But alas this is why we have feedback threads and this is one of those, so I implore all upon this thread to help us make a new name. Since we as a team had multiple picks and off-worlders was chosen as the easiest to pick-up for players, however, if they don't like it, it can always be changed to something better. I believe the other suggestions were: Spacers (But I know of characters who call themselves spacers too so that cannot be done), Spacies, Galactons, Low-gravs, Gravoids, Gravy bois,

Please restrict your posting to genuine feedback. Thank you.

So can non-factioneers "win" the event? Are players going to be rewarded for reporting them? What is security going to do about all this? Isn't this technically corporate espionage? Something I believe we already have laws for?

Sorry for the delay, locking and archiving.

Accepted, locking and archiving.

Locking and marking as processed.

Accepted, locking and archiving.

So recently Burger brought up that he has an issue with the three Nanopastes down in sub-level of science. As seen here: As he said it's been rushed basically every round by IPCs and IPC antags alike to be snatched and used in self-healing. So the suggestion was brought up that instead of changing the nanopaste itself the machines could be made fixable by other means so they could be deleted from that level. Burger didn't want to do it so I am making a suggestion thread that some other developer or someone with at least a passable ability of coding will see this and pick it up. Yes, xenoarchaeology isn't the most used department but outright removing the Nanopastes without substituting could cause some fatal mishaps, as they're pretty fucking dangerous since they let out radiation and explode when they overheat too much.

Due to the resolution of the other suggestion I'll be archiving this one. Locking and archiving.

I humbly accept the most important award.

It's a bit weird that in your thread where you try to reinforce the trust in staff and non-public communication you present two examples of staff being biased or making mistakes as main points. Perplexing boast, yet alas. Now don't get me wrong I get where you're coming from, the issue is this is going to have some serious unintended consequences which Bay has felt when they censored their own complaint threads. Paranoia. Let's say a thread appears, Character A killed Character B, your Character C saw it happen. You know that Character A did not kill Character B. An Admin accepts this complaint. A week later the admin concludes Character A is guilty and closes the complaint. Do you see what I mean? While it's admirable you trust us enough, as is demonstrated in this thread plenty of people don't. And I do understand where you're coming from in removal of toxicity, but this cannot be done by throwing a blanket over said toxicity. People are still going to be toxic, they'll just use every other medium available to express their opinion. Development is a perfect example, we have feedback threads, we have GitHub feedback threads, we have polls and we have the github log on discord. Yet with EVERY change the discord, private PM's, OOC and LOOC erupts into the discussion about this and that and how it's wrong and I am right. Imagine this happening with literally every single complaint thread and unlike the forums, discord is MUCH harder to administrate. In short, while I do admire this attempt I don't believe it's the right thing to do. I think it's the equivalent of putting a rug on the stain rather than cleaning it up. You are right in that change of character, a true change can only happen through discipline and learning. This is why the warning system exists if people do not learn, they get banned. So I'd rather see a person being reported for using history to call someone out, rather than holding my fingers crossed that the admin really did interview literally everyone possible.