Removes Cloning

[MattAtlas]

https://github.com/Aurorastation/Aurora.3/pull/7653

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- What about lore?

For all I care, cloning can stay in lore. What happens to it in lore is up to the lore writers. This thread is strictly about gameplay.

- Why are we removing it?

Cloning was born out of a mechanical need, because deaths in oldmed had the ability to be pretty cheesy. Since humans are tanky in brainmed, we don't actually need this anymore. It's harder to die and we gain more from removing it than keeping it in. Death is more meaningful in round, we don't have to deal with cloning traumas, and more.

- How do I get back into the round then?

You don't. Respawn as another character or move on. It's really, really hard to die if you're not directly involved in engagements.

[incognitojesus]

I think removing cloning is something this server has needed ever since the respawn timer was lowered to twenty minutes. People are no longer taken out of the round for half an hour, and it does make death more meaningful. Hopefully this will curb officers charging into the line of fire, and make people think twice about how actions could affect their characters. I support this.

[Garnascus]

Very much long overdue. Cloning no longer has a place here when its so difficult to die. 

[Doc]

The server has needed cloning removed for literal years now. Brainmed finally makes it unforgivable for it to remain. 

[Alberyk]

Cloning has to go, brainmed makes death far less common and harder to happen, giving a lot of chances to rescue people.

[Brutishcrab51]

Give us an alternative to cloning before removing it.

TriAdrenaline, defibs, some sort of fancy heart-restarting chemical. Not necessarily something that treats the heart, since you could theoretically just keep placing kits on the brain to treat brain damage and repair the organs in-surgery.

Just a chemical for heart-restarts and I'll be happy with this.

[Scheveningen]

TEN THOUSAND YEARS

yes please speedmerge this 

[Kaed]

Praise brainmed for bringing us this miracle

[MattAtlas]

3 minutes ago, Brutishcrab51 said:

Give us an alternative to cloning before removing it.

TriAdrenaline, defibs, some sort of fancy heart-restarting chemical. Not necessarily something that treats the heart, since you could theoretically just keep placing kits on the brain to treat brain damage and repair the organs in-surgery.

Just a chemical for heart-restarts and I'll be happy with this.

The latter is literally already a thing, adrenaline

[Doxxmedearly]

This is a boon for the server. Reduces LOOC/Dchat "OMG CLONE ME / why aren't they cloning me" salt/whining. Fits our new medical system. And who knows, maybe psychs will be seen again, coming back to do RP without having to worry about dealing with post-cloning traumas. 

Hopefully this will make people be as cautious as you should be ICly. 

[Brutishcrab51]

13 minutes ago, MattAtlas said:

The latter is literally already a thing, adrenaline

Then it's my fault that I didn't already know that. This is good.

[Aticius]

12 minutes ago, Brutishcrab51 said:

Give us an alternative to cloning before removing it.

TriAdrenaline, defibs, some sort of fancy heart-restarting chemical. Not necessarily something that treats the heart, since you could theoretically just keep placing kits on the brain to treat brain damage and repair the organs in-surgery.

Just a chemical for heart-restarts and I'll be happy with this.

This, this this this.

 

Mistakes happen- bugs, incompetence, the like. Giving a last ditch, emergency, procedure that brings a player back int the round is a good thing; even if it doesnt bring them back in more than an RP sense.

 

Having a way to bring a player back in a lessened capacity is a good thing, i feel, and won't punish players for someone else not knowing what they're doing.

 

(Heart restarts are already a thing. Adrenaline, CPR, Defibrillators.)

[Scheveningen]

If heart restarts are already a thing we don't really need anything else, I think we are good to go to remove cloning.

[Bear]

I'm okay with this as long as cloning stays in lore. Too many people's characters would be affected otherwise. It is simple enough to argue that company policy decided such an invasive procedure wasn't safe outside of a true hospital like on the Odin.

[N8-Toe]

Mechanics wise. Great, amazing. I love it. we need it gone. and on "we need something in its place". CPR and rapid medical treatment fits that gap. 

 

Lore wise, I think cloning should be made illegal, or otherwise removed as an option going forwards. nothing, and I mean NOTHING is worse than the phrase "They can be cloned on Odin". you may as well be a school kid yelling "nuh uh! I have an everything proof shield". This allows characters with cloning in their backstory to stick with it but prevents the aforementioned crap. 

[Crozarius]

I don't like cloning being removed, though I can see the need for maybe removing it. It sucks that the shitty actions of a few powergamers is going to result in the wholesale removal of something that benefits everyone.

 

But regardless of what happens, keep cloning in-lore. Everyone else has bought up established characters, but nobody is talking about how cloning is a very large part of the thematics of our server lore and most importantly the spirituality in our lore- how each religion views cloning. 

[KingOfThePing]

Removing cloning from the server but not the lore is Christmas coming early this year. Farewell, you will not be missed.

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

What options do people who still die have? Such as depressurization.  Just past round i had medical had about 5 recovered bodies.

[Peppermint]

My issue is always gonna be the same with this. Perma-killing characters in a video game like this isn't fun, and unless this is going to be enforced by rules (Fuucckkk that), it's going to be odd to have someone die and then wander around the next round just because. If people really want cloning gone from the ship - though I don't agree with removing things like that - that's okay, I guess. My problem is mostly removing choice from a game like this is always bad imo. 

[furrycactus]

Cloning can go mechanically, it's not needed with brainmed, but it's far too big a thing to be removed from lore. It's a massive thing in that it's what made Zeng-Hu Pharmaceuticals what it is today - being developed and patented in a joint effort by them and skrell researchers, and they went through a great deal of work that changed it from a mistrusted practice to something well-accepted throughout the galaxy. Backpedaling on that seems shitty. Skrell make considerable use of it, just as humans do, and Unathi religion has aspects that touch on it too. Completely removing it from lore by making it illegal or suddenly bad to do feels extremely and excessively ham-fisted. 

Perhaps the simplest solution is to have the cloning facilities on the Aurora removed and given to the Upsilon instead; another thing to make Auroran employees bitter about and to reinforce that they're much better than us. Or, perhaps give it to the NSS Canis Minor station, the dedicated medical station also in Tau Ceti that's never referenced. This way, cloning isn't done in-rounds anymore and it's gone mechanically, but it still remains at large in the lore given its importance, and characters that want deaths to become canon for cloning arcs still have the option to do so if they want. 

[Guest Marlon Phoenix]

Is being unconscious but not dead for prolonged periods of tjme better than being dead and clonable? I don't think so. Cloning provides a higher rate of player retention after death.

[Melariara]

I dislike the idea of a character dying on extended and then never seeing them again because they accidentally walked out an airlock when they shouldn't have. Or hivebots happened. Or spiders spawned baby spiders in their stomachs. Please keep it in the lore or something or yes, add more drugs to bring people back if other methods don't work.

I also feel like psychologists are going to have even less of a role. They'll be there to talk to for those who already have issues but ah, what else now?

[Alberyk]

About the death stuff, the rules explain a bit on it:

Quote

Character deaths and antagonist actions are generally assumed to be non-canon, though this can be worked around if done sensibly.

So, the argument of dying in extended due to carp or slipping on lube should not really take in consideration.

[Flamingo]

I am in support of the removal of cloning. Brainmed making death less common to ridiculous stuff only reinforces that to me. 

[BurgerBB]

I cannot support this until defibs are coded. I'm a strong advocate of removing cloning (My two main characters cannot be cloned mechanically or have DNRs) but a PR on its own that removes cloning is an extremely bad idea.

 

Like I'm all for the "cloning is bad" bandwagon but everyone seriously needs to take a step back and realise what exactly this PR does.