Sleepy's Command Whitelist - Goldman Time

[SleepyWolf]

[b]BYOND key:[/b] sleepywolf

[b]Character names:[/b]

Spoiler

[b]How long have you been playing on Aurora?:[/b] 7-8 years now??

[b]Have you received any administrative actions? And how serious were they?[/b]  Yes, a permaban and a few temps like 5 years ago, and then nothing for a long time.

[b]Please provide well articulated answers to the following questions in a paragraph each.[/b]

[b]What do you think the OOC purpose of a Head of Staff is, ingame?:[/b] I feel it can be both antagonizing your staff below you to drive a story a bit, or pushing them to work their best. Heads of staff don't have to be amazingly charismatic people that work well with everyone and know everyones issues and how to solve social situations, sometimes they can just be there to drive a story - antagonize people with paperwork and orders, organizing them into groups but being too stubborn to change the groups when someone says 'I just don't like this guy', because they want them to 'Find a way to work together' - because that would be a better narrative! I have characters that are both ways, the 'Just work, you punks' and the 'Fuck, okay, I'll fix that with you guys by diagnosing the issue and fixing it slowly and diplomatically.'

[b]What do you think the OOC responsibilities of Whitelisted players are to other players, and how would you strive to uphold them?:[/b] To be role models, sort of? Whitelisted players are usually the most recognizable characters since they're communicating to every member in the department, and have to communicate with other department heads as well. Whitelisted players should also keep their toxicity levels to a Minimum most of the time, uphold the standards of roleplay on the server, and realize that rules are meant to be followed, because if someone sees a whitelisted player break rules constantly they feel they can do the same.

[b]Could you give us the gist of what is currently happening in Tau ceti and how it affected your character and their career?[/b] The phoron shortage and expansion of Tau Ceti's space after the Solarian Collapse has had corporate working hard to scrounge up all the resources they can. Even though the Stellar Corporate Conglomerate is 'technically' united, the infighting between the Corporations has never been so active. Battles aren't won with battleships and warriors - but with corporate grants and skilled administration. This is where Goldman has excelled in understanding the war going on. The value of Money and Fame are what help give the perceptions of Corporate dominance - and specifically, Nanotrasen's dominance as the leader of the Stellar Corporate Conglomerate's expansion in this ever tedious galaxy.

[b]What roles do you plan on playing after the application is accepted?[/b] Captain, Chief Engineer, Queen of Corpses consular.

[b]Have you familiarized yourself with the wiki pages for the command roles?[/b] yes

[b]Characters you intend to use for command or have created for command. Include the job they will be taking.:[/b]

Kobi Goldman - Captain

Aez Goldhorn - Chief Engineer

Ta'Akaix'Scar'pia Zo'ra - Consular

Aviq'Draa Qorli-Starchild - Captain/Research Director

[b]Do you understand your whitelist is not permanent, and may be stripped following continuous administrative action?[/b]

i do . .

😢

[b]Extra notes:[/b]

 

[Gr33d]

I really enjoy playing with sleepy wolfs characters. They are wonderful to Rp with and personally I feel they would be wonderful at the job. +1

[KingOfThePing]

This is like your fourth time to apply for Head, why did you lose the whitelist the last times?

[Butterrobber202]

All of my support I can give to an application. Sleepy is a wonderful player and excellent RPer. I've thoroughly enjoyed all my interactions with their characters on the station. +1

[SleepyWolf]

34 minutes ago, KingOfThePing said:

This is like your fourth time to apply for Head, why did you lose the whitelist the last times?

when you live as long as i have.......

the first few times i applied were in 2015 and 2016, i didn't get accepted for some of them im pretty sure, i don't think they matter because i dont remember.

the most recent time i lost my whitelist was when i went SSD as civilian and engineering roles twice and i was temp-banned for 3 days. i appealed the ban since they were at the ends of rounds in deadhour and it was removed, but my whitelist removal stayed since it's procedure.

 

Edited November 7, 2021 by SleepyWolf

[DeadLantern]

The reason why Sleepy lost their head whitelist was due to something completely unrelated to their ability to play command. Their characters are absolutely delightful to experience, and there is zero reason not to give them the trial.

[KingOfThePing]

I didnt know, that is why I asked. Cant day much about Goldman, too long that I've seen them to comment on command play. 

[Colfer]

I very often do not remember peoples characters but Sleepys characters actually stand out and most of the time I say "Damn! I wish I got to play somebody like that first" because they are so good and creative, sometimes even out of the box thinking. If I could give more than a +1 I would, but as it stands, this is a big +1 from me homie

[RyverStyx]

+1 I love sleepy’s command characters and they bring genuine, enjoyable roleplay to the round. It would be a shame for them to lose their whitelist permanently.

[ShesTrying]

I’ll handle this app. Keep gathering feedback pls! 

[ImmortalRedshirt]

Really only one proper response to this, isn't there? This is a solid +1 from me. I've only interacted with Goldhorn, but if that moment wasn't one of the best roleplayed out moments I've ever had(that line about "antagonizing your staff to drive the story" rang very, very true there), I don't know what is!

[greenjoe]

Goldman is great, would be cool to see him back. +1

[Marlon P.]

A very good roleplayer and commander +1

[ShesTrying]

Your trial starts today, 11/10, and ends on next Wednesday, 11/17. Best of luck! Please continue to gather feedback.

[Faye <3]

I am not looking forwards to seeing Goldman as Captain again. Their character presses the boundary of disbelief in a way that is extremely frustrating. Playing command alongside Goldman is usually an extremely frustrating and, quite frankly, uncomfortable experience. A Captain should not exist around intentionally antagonizing and making uncomfortable their command staff. Command is stressful and frustrating enough in running the station, and I do not want to see a whacky character that exists around social powerplays and intentionally discomforting, if not outright insulting their staff in a manner that presses the bounds of wackiness and believability. Take, for example, the round in which they refused to evacuate a severely destroyed station for literal OOC hours to save their IC reputation. They would not answer faxes, and would not heed Central, nor would they heed their IC command-staff. When Goldman is captain, it causes me to quite literally re-evaluate how I play command. If I see Goldman, I know that I will have to not only balance the needs of the crew, but also childmind Goldman and deal with whatever frustrating, power-tripping drama he stirs up whether it is making command uncomfortable, or provoking crewmembers. It often feels like as command, your main opposition is no longer the antagonist. The antagonist becomes almost secondary to trying to mitigate whatever Goldman is doing, and trying to maintain some semblance of peace and order on the Aurora.

I think sleepy is a great RP'er and capable of command. However, I do not want to see Goldman again. My aversion to the character is strong enough to make me consider if I really want to join or not. It's very unfortunate because Sleepy's other command characters are good, and I do not have any complaints with them. But the presence of Goldman is a deal breaker.

-1. 

Edited November 11, 2021 by Faye <3

[Susan]

I am in the same boat as Faye; while I believe Sleepy is perfectly capable as a roleplayer, and have seen them in action, Kobi Goldman is without a doubt one of my least favorite characters to ever have to suffer through a round with, and I do not use this language lightly. Seeing this character as Captain is an immediate indication as to whether or not I want to join a round.

For example, in the previous round to this post, ID ceX-ajxF, Goldman exhibited behavior typical of the character - causing needless drama by having people arrested for not following orders that were nonsensical at best and illegal at worst, followed by his vehement reluctance to call any form of ERT. As a whitelist holder, SleepyWolf is expected to give antagonists leeway, sure; however, they are also expected to prevent gimmicks from becoming entirely one-sided, and in this round, despite the majority of security being infected with a "disease" and crew slaughtering each other and dying in the halls, he refused to call an ERT all the way until the end where he was overwhelmed in the bridge - and then proceeded to engage in violent, fantastical behavior as an "infected" (see: vampire).

Thus, an extended period of time in an already long-drawn out round was spent having ridiculous torture-porn-esque antag roleplay on a station with barely any victims left, as the majority had already fled. Instead of a clean round end, like a shuttle, or an evacuation, things were unnecessarily prolonged, and Goldman provided security with little to no guidance while they struggled under a tsunami of shenanigans.

While a single incident, this is a reoccurring theme with SleepyWolf's Goldman character. I absolutely dread being security in a Goldman round. A previous incident involving an Unathi engineering apprentice turned a simple insult into a 2 hour affair of his character skirting the line and prompting the lizard to assault him, dragging the entirety of security into some strange ego-contest. This made me uncomfortable entirely on an OOC level, as the lizard's conduct resulted in an IR that they were essentially baited into by Goldman. There have been rounds where he's nonsensically flouted quarantine to have changelings displayed in the chapel, kept a round going for hours after the station was basically ravaged by a blob past the point of safe habitability, and several where he has utterly refused to call any sort of ERT to the detriment of the round and the people playing it. To say dealing with Goldman is a frustration is a massive understatement.

Given these experiences, I cannot support this application. While the initial reason for it's removal was strange and absurd, Kobi Goldman's conduct is inherently deserving of a whitelist strip in of itself, I would argue. They continuously make rounds un-fun for me and others, and I cannot understand why.

[Roostercat]

I can also echo the sentiment behind Goldman. There have been many times where he really pushes the self antagging rule. Constantly forcing Security to release changelings and/or stepping into a cell with them, trying to hire traitors as NT assassins, and so on. There has even been a time where my character was ordered to go to the brig to go face to face with a changeling who claimed to have every intent on murdering me, and I was threatened with arrest if I didn't go. That was frustrating enough to just make me want to cryo, so I did.

On top of this, it feels like Goldman does not actually do his job as Captain whilst this all happens. A lot of requests go ignored, Red alert is put on forever, I don't believe I have ever seen him send a fax to central despite multiple reminders. On one round, there was a hostage situation in the brig. He ordered all security to it, as would be expected. The problem is that a hivebot invasion just north of medical then occurred. Goldman ordered all security to stay in the bridge, and threatened them if they tried to leave to deal with the hivebots. These hivebots then broke into medical, forcing everyone to run away, and the round went on like this for another hour to two hours on red alert because Goldman refused to let security do anything about it, and transfer could not be called because of the Red Alert. Goldman also adamantly REFUSED to call the emergency shuttle to save his IC reputation.

Normally, I'd be willing to support the app as I know Sleepy is a good roleplayer that can be competent, but I cannot bring myself to support it as long as Goldman behaves like this.

[Kaizr]

Allow me to preface with this, SleepyWolf is an amazing roleplayer and I would ultimately like to see them get their whitelist back.

4 minutes ago, Susan said:

Goldman provided security with little to no guidance while they struggled under a tsunami of shenanigans.

Now, to add to this, and I apologize if I am dog piling on this point. I was security during this round (Nassa Zisk'as), and hadn't so much as seen or heard from Goldman until long after I had been turned into a vampire (minimal contact before, once in medbay and that was it). When asked over the radio multiple times for guidance, we received little to no communication from Goldman as the station was falling apart around us. However, I ultimately don't think anything could have been done, that does not excuse the complete and total lack of communication as he was held up in the bridge (behind the blast doors). 

 

Moving forward...

 

Do I think SleepyWolf is deserving of a whitelist in the end? Yes. Do I think they need to shift how they play command before that? Yes. I have only ever had the chance to interact with Goldman, and in every single one of them, he has acted rather outlandishly for someone holding the rank of captain on an SCC station. Sadly, this leaves me with mostly negative impressions, even if I like the character and Sleepy as a person. So, overall, I regretablly have to leave this with a -1 until there is a notable change in the way Sleepy goes about playing command.

[Rabid Animal]

I personally find Goldman to be a breath of fresh air, especially in terms of the standard command play, which is frankly extremely closed off from the rest of the crew and sometimes even their own departments. Having a command player spend 30 minutes of a round locked in their office doing paperwork or some other shit instead of engaging with crew in interesting ways is a bad habit that ought to be shook. Sleepy has always been very good at engagement, and I seriously respect them and their characters. Goldman being antagonistic often adds more to a round than it subtracts, he breaks away from the norm and in doing so nearly always catches my attention. The sheer amount of praise surrounding the character should be evident enough of this, even if he makes it harder for the station to "win" every scenario, like it often does.

 

I'm not sure if this last round is very indicative of good or bad play, it had escalated fairly suddenly and most players would be scrambling at what to do - to be so angry that the round lasted longer than you'd like is unfair to sleepy, considering several votes had been called and an overwhelming majority of players wanted the round to continue. I think there was definitely a sense of being overwhelmed, but fuck it - it was essentially a zombie invasion and no where near the norm for even a highly active antag round.

 

I find Goldman to be greedy, not outlandish. The idea of protecting your reputation over calling an ERT or a shuttle the second someone stubs their toe is far more realistic and interesting than many command gimmicks. I think Sleepy is a good roleplayer, and I wish I played with them more. I think the way their whitelist was lost was unfair, and they should get it back. This app gets a +1 from me

[Billy Mays]

+1, Love Aez, and Goldman. They are a amazing role-player and I enjoy playing with them. I do hope they get their whitelist back. I do agree that the way they play their character is a breath of fresh air and unique.

 

Edited November 11, 2021 by Billy Mays

[NewOriginalSchwann]

Kobi Goldman is, in my view, one of the most unpleasant characters I have ever interacted with on the Aurora. This is a very severe statement to make, so let me justify my stance through two main reasons:

1). Goldman is “whacky” as a character

- Goldman does a lot of irrational, “off-the-walls things” when he’s played that other heads of staff balk at doing. To some (as seen by the support Sleepy has gotten in this thread) this is very fun, and creates easily memorable rounds. However, to those that don’t enjoy his zany hijinks, there is no way to escape from Goldman due to the fact that...

2). Goldman has unquestioned authority as a captain

- As our wiki states: “The Captain is in charge of the station and everyone on it. [...] They are expected to be able to command their Heads of Staff effectively, and have ultimate authority on the station, second only to CentComm.” Effectively, this means that there is no way to say “no” to Goldman’s insane gimmicks that he uses to spice up rounds without faxing CCIA (which only heads of staff can do) and waiting for a response, which can take a very long time. If you don’t enjoy being in his focus, your only real option is to cryo.

Those are my two main points, but I have other gripes. Having played with and observed Goldman during a variety of rounds, I find him to be completely and utterly insane by the standards of any reasonable character. No reasonable captain would spend most of his time antagonizing the crew, delaying transfer shuttles, and stroking his own ego in order to outcompete arbitrary numbers the player has made up. I can frankly say that I have never had an enjoyable Goldman round (even when I was fortunate enough to not be the center of his attention), and that his mere presence is enough to dissuade me from playing rounds. Ultimately to me the character is unrealistic, despite how much praise it gets, and feels more like a bad caricature of an “asshole boss” than something with any substance behind it. I cannot support the command application of somebody who makes a character like this.

[Caelphon]

I've roleplayed with Aez, Goldman and Starchild. I do not recall if I have roleplayed with the Consular Ta.

Aez and Starchild are always enjoyable to roleplay with, and they always make the round interesting. I enjoy their character concepts (the information I have gained through talking with the aforementioned characters) and I do believe their return would be welcome! 

Regarding Goldman, I do not think that hes "out there" but a few other players seem to share the same sentiment. Would you be opposed to tweaking the character concept for Goldman, or would you rather retire him? Has anyone ever brought an feedback regarding Goldman to you personally? 

Regardless, this app has my support. Sleepy is a fantastic roleplayer, and an even better lore writer. I have no doubt they'd be able to accomplish great things as Command, especially with the NBT on the horizon. 

Edit:

After reading the latest incident report, I believe that Goldman should not make a return. I think they are best left off the NSS Aurora. 

Edited November 11, 2021 by Caelphon

[ReadThisNamePlz]

Hello. 

I need to preface this with that I have nothing against Sleepywolf. I think they are an excellent player and an excellent roleplayer. However, I am concerned about Goldman. 
This is my opinion as a player. Not as an admin or whitelist maintainer.

A Captain should not be so worried about reputation, but instead the company. You have worked atleast ten years for NanoTrasen. You already have a good reputation as a Captain. You're the top 1% of a station's crew and the top of the chain of command on station. A Captain should be more worried about the companies interests rather than their own. You are loyal to the company. You are a step below Central Command. You're at the top in most cases. A Captain should be more interested in what is best for the crew and the company, not themselves. Goldman does not do this. Goldman is the exact opposite of this mindset of which I believe a Captain should have. And not only that, but Goldman doesn't even have the slightest parallels to this. 

Last night, Goldman ordered mandatory scans and arrests for those who did not comply. Atleast in my case. A Captain should not be ordering for crew to be brutalized in the event that they do not get into a medical scanner. No attempt was made to know why the character would not, until after the "arrest" happened. 

Sleepy is an excellent roleplayer and I love Aez, but I cannot support this application if it means Goldman coming back. 
-1 
 

[The7thLain]

Heya.

This is a descriptive breakdown as to my feelings on SleepyWolf as a roleplayer and their character Captain Kobi Goldman. 

I do not think it can be understated how good of a roleplayer that Seepy can be, they have a brilliant skill in working one-on-one interactions and bringing characters with otherwise strange or quirky personalities to a level where anyone can interact with them and they feel genuine, rather than a character that exists simply for the sake of being weird. Aez Goldhorn, Chief Engineer, is a lovely example of this, he is a command character that is both compelling as a character with a very fun personality and he fills the role of being a command member well, due to his propensity to connect and involve his department in many ways with his command actions in a positive way that is conducive to good RP. I believe that SleepyWolf is perfectly capable of playing a good and compelling command character, but this is not always the reality when they play their Captain, Kobi Goldman.

I like Kobi as a personality in individual interactions, it exudes that very insincere, luxurious, and selfish character that hides behind corporate mindset, though I am unsure if the extent to which this is played up is within the realm of plausibility for a Captain. What I am concerned about both as a fellow command player, I played the Head of Personnel in the vampire round (Round ID: ceX-ajxF), that many seem to be bringing up in this thread, and as a player of roles outside of exclusively command though, is how this character translates to not just a character in a round, but the role of Captain presiding over the crew. I understand the intent to make things perhaps a bit difficult for one's crewmates so as to produce RP, but there I think is a very difficult line between creating tension and borderline self-antagging as a captain by creating exceptionally rigid and inflexible framework through which command and crew are expected by all convention and sense of the rules due to the Captain's near-absolute authority on station, to abide by.

1 hour ago, ReadThisNamePlz said:

Last night, Goldman ordered mandatory scans and arrests for those who did not comply. Atleast in my case. A Captain should not be ordering for crew to be brutalized in the event that they do not get into a medical scanner. No attempt was made to know why the character would not, until after the "arrest" happened. 

I was present for this exchange, again, as the HoP for that round, and I will use it and the events immediately following it to illustrate my concern and dissatisfaction with Kobi's command. After Read's character declined this mandate to be scanned, my HoP tried to explain the process to them and why medical release forms were being handed to them to sign, something that I did upon the request of the Captain to do interpreted from the captain telling my character to ensure that all the paperwork was in order for the goings-on. The tension around this in specific, I think was good and organized in a way that created some tension among the crew but also among the crew and command, and even within the Security department itself. This was good rp and a build-up of interesting tension. Where I think this fell apart however, is the reaction from Captain Goldman to dispatch the warden to track down Read's officer and bringing her back kicking and screaming into the medbay under threat of physical harm or arrest as the first response, though this also could have been the fault of the Warden's player for resorting to violence and force as a first measure, and I admit that the blame for this may not entirely lie on Goldman. In my opinion this was a gross over-escalation of the conflict, one that I disagreed with both ICly and OOCly, and one that also detracted from the roleplay experience of those in the medbay as the main plot progression of the round, the "vampire disease," began to really take hold and start to effect some of the crew present in that department of the station. What followed afterwards however was in my view the most frustrating part of the round in relation to Goldman's command, in that there really wasn't any. Kobi took Read's officer back to chat in the CMO's office to discuss the situation and from that time onwards until about ten-fifteen minutes later he was effectively off comms as a crisis unfolded in the very department he was in, with both the CMO and my HoP trying to contact him for updates or orders, or and ordering of a response to the growing crisis in medbay, with the CMO audibly expressing her decaying state of mental and physical health over the command, common, and medical channels.

This inability to communicate with command staff is something that is admittedly  common among many captains, perhaps a majority, but that does not mean that it is not a flaw that should be overlooked. The captain is the top of the command structure and should use his heads of staff as means to push his agenda or goal on the station, but should also be a resource for those heads of staff in times of crisis instead of sequestering himself and not using radio communication. This kind of behaviour would have been understandable after things truly started to fall apart, such as when he locked himself in the bridge, I think this move was fine and I don't object to it OOCly; I think it showed both the desperate nature of the situation and the cowardly underside of Goldman's personality and character very well. However, in reference to before he locked himself away, a captain should be involved and communicating with his command staff whenever possible, and especially so during a station-wide crisis so that he and his crew can try to stop it. This is not to say that he should not have spoken to Read's officer at all, I think this was also a good play on Sleepy's part and one that did involve him with his crew, but I am saying that activity on comms and communicating with command during his exchange with Read's officer would have been more emblematic of what kind of command play I would expect from a Captain.

In conclusion, Sleepy is a very good and skilled roleplayer with years of experience and a person who I get genuine enjoyment from roleplaying with a lot of the time. They have also shown themselves to be capable of playing a command role on their CE, Aez Goldhorn, but, I believe that Captain Kobi Goldman needs some adjustment and revision to the style by which he is involved in rounds to better suit the position of a Captain and the duties expected thereof.

For these reasons I cannot give a +1 or -1, and instead will simply let my opinion be used as feedback both for and against the granting of Sleepy's whitelist. I think they are very capable of playing command, but that this needs to be demonstrated more consistently, especially on the character of Kobi Goldman.

Edited November 11, 2021 by TheBurninSherman

[Kintsugi]

I'm going to have to reluctantly throw down the gauntlet and say that as long as Sleepy intends to play Goldman, I need to -1 this application. I'm going to essentially echo the sentiment shared by the other -1ers - Sleepy is by no means a bad roleplayer or a bad player, and on paper Goldman isn't a bad character either, but in practice his presence and actions on station are deeply frustrating. Goldman near-universally feels like a destabilizing presence that often acts in the least helpful way. This is fine for a character without any authority - but this is the captain, and the only authority higher than him isn't on station and can only be contacted by another member of command. He, not infrequently, comes off as a borderline self-antag, and if you did not know the character, you'd find yourself wondering if he WAS an antagonist or not. When you desperately need command's help or leadership and instead get someone who will do anything but help you, that stops being interesting after the first few times, and starts being infuriating. A captain that only ever undermines the station is not a good captain at all.

I'm going to keep this brief and just say that I didn't realize how much I didn't want Goldman to come back until I saw him on-server. If that sounds mean, I am sorry - I am just trying to be as honest as possible. Again, I have no problem with Sleepy, only the character Sleepy plays. I think the fact they even lost their WL in the first place is unfair, but Goldman has to go, in my opinion. I am not easily discouraged from playing rounds by the characters I see on the manifest, but if there is one that will make me avoid a round, it is Goldman.